Two Powers in Heaven

by peacefulpete 14 Replies latest watchtower bible

  • peacefulpete
    peacefulpete

    While this topic might at first seem to come from left field, it has arisen in my mind when reading a number of recent threads. This topic in full requires many hours of research to fully assimilate but I'm now only introducing the topic and encouraging further reading.

    In short, by the end of the common era Judaism included various heavenly figures that took on roles that, for all practical purposes, were those of God. I've mentioned certain ones in threads debating the Trinity in which I described them as 'emanations' of the deity. Concepts like Wisdom and Logos, even Light had been thoroughly personified and carried the weight of divinity toward a certain goal or reflections of an aspect of God. Writings of Philo of Alexandria, the diverse Wisdom literature and Qumran documents illustrate this well. In addition, interpretations of the 'Servant' of deutero-Isaiah, developing angelology, Shekhinah personifications, the enigmatic Son of Man of Daniel and Enoch literature all coalesced into what Rabbis later called the "Two Powers" theology. A conflation with the Davidic Kingly material from the Psalms contributed royal elements. Many passages in the OT and related literature were seen as support for worshipping this other power alongside YHWH.

    Christianity naturally utilized these preexisting developments in its character of Christ. Some would argue this was the source of the Christain religion, formalized via visionary experiences and not just a post hoc justification for adoration of Christ. Either way, all of these elements are consciously used to describe Christ. Much research has been done regarding this "Two Powers" theology within Judaism prior to Christianity's formation.

    I'd strongly recommend:

    Alan Segal's Two Powers in Heaven: Early Rabbinic Reports About Christianity and Gnosticism: Segal: 9780391041721: Amazon.com: Books

    And

    Brown's Two Gods in Heaven: Jewish Concepts of God in Antiquity: Schäfer, Peter, Brown, Allison: 9780691181325: Amazon.com: Books

    Also an excellent article that describes these notions as not heretical but simply different from the later Rabbinic (Post Christian) thought. Beyond Judaisms: Metatron and the Divine Polymorphy of Ancient Judaism (ebscohost.com)

    As to how this concept could have originated Sigmund Mowinckel, held that ‘Conceptions of a more or less divine Primordial Man were widespread in the ancient east. Apparently, there is a historical connection between the varying figures of this type, which seem to be derived, directly or indirectly, from Iranian or Indo-Iranian myths.’1 The Jewish conception of ‘the Son of Man’ was ‘a Jewish variant of this oriental, cosmological, eschatological myth of Anthropos’,2 influenced by a syncretistic fusion of Iranian and Mesopotamian concepts. At the least, the phrase ‘Son of Man’ was thought to be a well-known, readily recognizable title for a messiah of a heavenly type, in contrast to the national, earthly, Davidic messiah. As recently as 1974 Norman Perrin could claim that all the recent studies of the ‘Son of Man Problem’ he had reviewed agreed on one point: ‘there existed in ancient Judaism a defined concept of the apocalyptic Son of Man, the concept of a heavenly redeemer figure whose coming to earth as judge would be a feature of the drama of the End time.’

    The Son of Man in First-Century Judaism* | New Testament Studies | Cambridge Core

    Moving on then.... It might be surprising but diverse preChristian conceptualizations of this divine figure influenced writers of the NT in subtle ways. For example, recent threads have debated when the Christ was to become King. Nicklesburg's excellent article Son of Man בר אנשׁ — Brill (brillonline.com) expounded upon this aspect. He suspects the ways Gospel writers understood the term Son of Man influenced how they envisioned his power. Matt has the Son of Man wielding kingly power at the eschaton while Luke and John see his exaltation as accomplished facts.

    Anyway, maybe some of this material will stimulate research and a better understanding of 2nd Temple Judaism and the origins of Christianity.



  • Phizzy
    Phizzy

    Interesting ! I have a feeling this will change a lot of what I have thought up until now, I have some reading to do !

  • peacefulpete
    peacefulpete

    Sorry, a lot of this material is behind paywalls. If you have university connections this off works. But using some of the key words there is much out there for free.

  • peacefulpete
    peacefulpete

    Add to the Son of Man anticipations, the various other expectations such as the Messiah ben Joseph/David elements Messiah ben Joseph - Wikipedia A Dying and Rising Josephite Messiah in 4Q372 - Bright Morning Star

    Then take the expectations that the King/High Priest Messiah would be a returned Joshuah/Jesus (Zechariah 6:11)

  • peacefulpete
    peacefulpete

    I see the link to the ebscohost article doesn't work today. Here it is: 148 Beyond Judaisms (2010).pdf (berkeley.edu)

  • peacefulpete
    peacefulpete

    2 Esdras 7:28 My Son Joshua[a] will be revealed along with those who are with him, and those who remain will rejoice for four hundred years.

    29 “After these years, my Son the anointed one and all who have human breath will die. 30 The world will be turned back to primeval silence for seven days, as in the earliest beginnings so that no one is left alive.

  • peacefulpete
    peacefulpete

    Sybylline oracles 345: And4 one shall come again from heaven, a man Preeminent, whose hands on fruitful tree By far the noblest of the Hebrews stretched, Who at one time did make the sun stand still 350 When he spoke with fair word and holy lips, No longer vex thy soul within thy breast By reason of the sword, rich child of God, Flower longed for by him only, goodly light And noble branch, a scion much beloved....

    There are many expectations in the late 2nd temple period that contributed to the Jeus/Christ story. If this is of interest to you Phizzy. Or anyone else.

  • cofty
    cofty

    PP - I was listening to a lecture by Bart Ehrman on this very topic yesterday.

    I am persuaded that nobody thought of Jesus in divine terms during his lifetime, neither did he make any such claims.

    Jewish monotheism was more nuanced than we may have thought for the reasons you have outlined above. It was this background that made it possible to take the first steps after Jesus' death that ended in belief in his divinty.

  • peacefulpete
    peacefulpete

    cofty...Erhman , while very willing to shed Christian dogma is still reluctant (to say the least) to consider the possibility that there was no Jesus. The question facing serious scholarship at this point is: Is the hypothesis that a man became deified really more probable than a theological concept, a purely visionary character becoming incarnated? Both have precedents/parallels. Effectively each proposed re-creation draws elements from the purely ethereal and tangible. In my mind the "historical Jesus" has become a secular dogma as unflaggable as a religious position.

  • cofty
    cofty

    I find it impossible to take the mythical Jesus hypothesis seriously.

    Richard Carrier et al get very angry about all evidence to the contrary.

    Erhman , while very willing to shed Christian dogma is still reluctant (to say the least) to consider the possibility that there was no Jesus

    Not only has Ehrman considered the possibility that there was no historical Jesus he tackled the evidence in detail and wrote an entire book on the subject.

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