"Circumcision is a sign to set you apart from the people of the nations"
We know that the Hebrew Scriptures, or Old Testament states that the practice of circumcision (of males) was supposed to be yet another sign that set the Jews apart from the "people of the nations"
But apart from so many odd things, how dumb is this?
I mean, HOW did someone know if a male was circumcised or not??
Did people meet each other while walking in the desert , drops their pants, or lift their robes just to show each other their penis? "Now you can see from which nation I have come"
other religions do it too.
just shows it was a design fault to begin with.
I thought you guys piss in front of each other all the time - eew btw.
Well, let me see, did they have undies in those days or what?
Coz maybe your junk just flopped out from behind your robes or toga occasionally by accident to the gasp of any nearby jewish people if it was still wearing it's hoodie.
Very strange conversation stuck.
It is like the grease on your entrecote, you cut it off, it's not supposted to be eaten.
Yes it is quite a bizarre way to mark a "difference" or "ownership" of his people isn't it. Pretty much like branding a cow? Later they also had to wear special fringes on their garments - surely that was a more sensible and outwardly apparent approach? Why not just do that from the beginning - wold it not have been sufficient?
Aside from that I believe circumcision was practised in Egypt and in many other of the Canaanite cultures (don't quote me on that, but I believe I read it in a good quality source) - so that is most likely where it came from, rather than a divine edict. If so it certainly didn't make them "different."
Hi stuckinarut2, do you think that cultural attitudes may change over the centuries?
Maybe what we read about in Mark 14:51,52(NIV) was not an unusual occurrence in the Mediterranean culture of 2000 years ago.
Those verses read:
"51 A young man, wearing nothing but a linen garment, was following Jesus. When they seized him, 52 he fled naked, leaving his garment behind."
My point simply is, that while we would be embarrassed to be seen naked in public, public nudity was not a thing to be embarrassed about in those times. This was reflected in the many statues that have survived from Greek and Roman times. Like this one:
Known as "the dying Gaul", it is a sample of the art of that era. Do a search on the web, and you'll find many more.
In the ancient games of the era, the athletes competed naked, and even in the gymnasiums that the sons of the elites of the time attended, the young men would compete naked.
Its interesting to read in Maccabees of the Hellenisation of the Jews, after Alexander the Great conquered Palestine: (See 1 Maccabees ch. 1)
"10 The wicked ruler Antiochus Epiphanes, son of King Antiochus the Third of Syria, was a descendant of one of Alexander's generals. Antiochus Epiphanes had been a hostage in Rome before he became king of Syria in the year 137.[a]11 At that time there appeared in the land of Israel a group of traitorous Jews who had no regard for the Law and who had a bad influence on many of our people. They said,
Let's come to terms with the Gentiles, for our refusal to associate with them has brought us nothing but trouble. 12 This proposal appealed to many people, 13 and some of them became so enthusiastic about it that they went to the king and received from him permission to follow Gentile customs. 14 They built in Jerusalem a stadium like those in the Greek cities. 15 They had surgery performed to hide their circumcision, abandoned the holy covenant, started associating with[b] Gentiles, and did all sorts of other evil things."
So with many Greek colonies established in Palestine, many Jews wanted to "get with it" and compete in games like other people were doing. Of course, they competed naked, and this led to a cultural problem.
For Greeks it was OK to be seen naked, but they thought it shameful and suggestive to expose the glans (the head or tip) of the penis. In fact a greek athlete would pull his foreskin down and tie a ribbon around it to make sure that his foreskin would not retract during his gym or athletic practise.
If we saw that, we'd think it very strange, but that's the cultural difference. They would think that we were weird. In fact the Greeks thought the Jews were weird for exposing the glans of their penises.
Anyway the Jews that Maccabees speaks of, were embarrassed because their foreskins had been removed, and they tried it says, to have, "surgery performed to hide their circumcision."
(And no, I don't know for sure what they actually did). But we should never assume that any other group of people think the way we may think.
Egyptian s were doing it thousands of year before anyone ever heard of an Israelite
Yes, "God made man in His image"... except the penis part. That part he f*cked up.Quick, someone pass us a knife.
I have always thought the same thing. Additionally, circumcision misses half the population - women. I guess the Israelite god didn't think it was necessary for the women to have the special sign of having a covenant relationship with him so he picked a practice that only applied to men. Further evidence of how the bible discounts women. And Jesus was circumcised too. That means he could not have offered a ransom body that perfectly corresponded to Adam's. Adam was not circumcised since he pre-dates the practice.