PAROUSIA: The Watchtower's IRON BALLOON

by Terry 12 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

• 

  Island Man

  Parousia does indeed mean presence. But in the context that Jesus used it it has the functional equivalent of coming. In Matthew 24 Jesus uses coming and presence interchangeably because he has to first come in order to be present. So to speak of his presence means to also implicitly refer to his coming since he only becomes present as a result of his coming.

  Watchtower foolishly wants people to believe that Jesus becomes present before he comes, which is a foolishly illogical concept that can only spring from the mind of false prophet desperate to cover up his false prophecy.

  A careful reading of Matthew 24 would reveal that when Jesus said no one knows the day or hour, he was actually speaking of his presence - which is the inevitable result of his final coming (you cannot separate the two like the JWs are attempting to) . Immediately after saying no one knows the day or the hour he starts off with the word "For", which is another way of saying "because" then he speaks of his "presence" being just as what happened in the days of Noah. Thus he was actually saying that the day of his presence would be unknown! He compared this to the people of Noah's day not knowing the day the flood would come and so it caught them by surprize doing everyday activities. Look at the Greek! That's exactly what he was saying! He was saying no one knew but Watchtower mistranslates it as "they took no note".

  Then we have 2 Peter 3 where Peter consistently uses "presence" to refer to christ's actual final coming to destroy the wicked world. It is clear from the NT that "presence" of christ does not refer to a century long invisible presence as the JWs claim.
• 

  Island Man

  Matthew 24:36-40 should actually be, and makes more sense as (I've color coded related portions to show how the thoughts are linked together logically):

  "“Concerning that day and hour nobody knows,+ neither the angels of the heavens nor the Son, but only the Father.+ 37 For just as the days of Noah were,+ so the presence* of the Son of man will be.+ 38 For as they were in those days before the Flood, eating and drinking, men marrying and women being given in marriage, until the day that Noah entered into the ark,+ 39 and they did not know until the Flood came and swept them all away,+ so the presence of the Son of man will be. 40 Then two men will be in the field; one will be taken along and the other abandoned. 41 Two women will be grinding at the hand mill; one will be taken along and the other abandoned.+ 42 Keep on the watch, therefore, because you do not know on what day your Lord is coming."

  The point of comparison Jesus was making between his presence and the days of Noah is that people then did not know in advance when the flood would come, just as people would not know in advance the day of Jesus' presence.

  His reference to the people in Noah's day doing everyday activities like marrying, eating, drinking, etc, is a way of emphasizing the unexpected nature of the event - they had no clue what was about to happen as they were caught doing the activities of normal, peaceful, everyday life. He mentions this to impress on his followers mind just how sudden and completely unexpected his presence will be, catching everyone by surprize. He does this by likewise referring to people being out working in the field and grinding at the mill - normal, everyday activities - on the day of his sudden presence. His whole point was to impress upon their minds that sudden and unexpected nature of his presence and thus reinforcing his main theme to keep on the watch because you do not know when he is coming.

  Watchtower mistranslates the beginning of verse 39 by rendering it as "they took no note" as if to give the impression that they were not taking note of the sign of Noah's preaching as they were too caught up with everyday life. But's that's not the point Jesus was making. Jesus was simply emphasizing the unexpected nature of his presence to bolster his point about the need to keep on the watch.
• 

  Terry

  Every decade we peer through in order to see and "hear" Jesus colors and distorts.
  The process is called Accretion. It is a layer upon layer of changes, influences, reinterpretations.
  We are far removed from those times and we must look backward through time to arrive at Jesus
  

  Jews spoke a different language from Greek, Aramaic.
  Only a Jew who had grown up in a Grecianized commercial metropolis such as Tarsus, like Paul, would be exposed to the vocabulary and sense of Neo-Platonic ideas saturating everyday koine conversations.
  Jesus spoke to his followers in a primitive language (compared to Greek, the most logical and scientific language on Earth at that time.)

  Jesus' vocabulary was basic and unsophisticated and practically devoid of philosophical content even though Jews had struggled with Greek inculturation since the time of the Maccabees.
  So, why am I bringing all of this up?
  
  OUR INFORMATION IS IN GREEK not in Aramaic.

  Our information is thousands of years past.
  
  We are examining under a microscope something which NEVER EXISTED as such and seeking to make a science of it.
  
  Systematic Theology is a joke--but a serious joke where nobody laughs.

  The Watchtower 'scholars' (cough cough) are the joke of jokes because they "know better" than the genuine scholars.
  As Island Man pointed out, JW's believe in a presence before a coming because they've been tricked and their rational and analytical minds have been stifled and detuned. Plus, independent reasoning (which is exactly what the GB are all about in relation to mainstream scholarship)

  is verboten.
  
  

  .