Jesus Christ dead for three days and three nights really?

by Crazyguy 23 Replies latest watchtower bible

  • David_Jay
    David_Jay

    Cofty is correct.

    It is actually Church tradition that Jesus rose three days after his death. It isn’t Biblical. None of the Biblical reports of the resurrection of Jesus ever say anything of the sort that “three days later” Jesus rose from the tomb. Literalist Christians, like the Jehovah’s Witnesses, often use the texts of Matthew 12:40 and John 2:19 to support their stand for adopting the traditional view, but these texts are not reporting on the actual resurrection.


    The Harrowing of Hell: A Tradition Based on a Jewish Legend

    The Christian tradition came first, decades before the New Testament texts included actual resurrection narratives. The earliest composed gospels were “oracle gospels” or written collection of Jesus’ sayings. No narrative of any type was included. The so-called Q source is often believed to be such an “oracle gospel,” and the report of Papias in which he describes the apostle Matthew as having composed a gospel in Hebrew was likely such a sayings-source. The earliest gospel account, Mark, originally had no resurrection narrative as demonstrated in its oldest extant forms.

    The original oral tradition came to be known as the Harrowing of Hell. Though viewed as genuine theology in Catholicism, for instance, the story is the legend of Jesus’ trip to the Netherworld after his death on the cross. During this trip, Jesus redeems the faithful people of God who died before his passion and death. The earliest “written” form of this belief comes in the form of primitive Christian sarcophagi art depicting the prophet Jonah and the big fish or whale. The “three days” comes from this Old Testament/Tanakh story.

    The narrative of Jonah the prophet is a comedy, not literal history. While possibly the work of the actual prophet Jonah, it is a moral lesson, written in a form not too different from the genre employed by Aesop and his moral tales. Designed to teach the Jewish people that all races are God’s children and to demonstrate the evils of prejudice (shown by the negative attitudes and actions of Jonah), the story of Jonah being in Sheol for “three days and nights” and coming out to preach a message that “saved” the people of Nineveh is understood as a legend among Jews.

    Matthew 12:40

    It was likely viewed this way too by the earliest Christians. Note that while Matthew 12:40 has Jesus saying he “will be in the heart of the earth for three days and three nights,” the same gospel reports that Jesus died just hours before the Sabbath began (the day of preparation), was dead during the entire Sabbath (the day after the preparation), and rose the day after the Sabbath. (Matthew 27:26; 28:1) Apparently neither the author nor his audience had yet made a literal interpretation of Jonah’s legend to Jesus’ death or words. In Matthew, the expression at 12:40 is merely an example of Jesus rising after a death-like experience like Jonah’s, one that would end up in people being redeemed by a message to repent.--Note Matthew 12:41.*

    John 2:19

    John’s account is not literal by any respect. He rearranges the death of Jesus to occur on Thursday, the day of Preparation for the Passover when the lambs were slaughtered for the Seder meal instead of on Friday, as in the synoptics, which is the Preparation for the Sabbath. John does this because in his account Jesus is “the Lamb of God, who takes away the sin of the world.” (John 1:29) John is concerned with teaching not a literal but a very spiritual account of Jesus. Apparently moving Jesus’ death to Thursday also fit in with the Jonah legend and helped it develop into the “three days” that became a requisite for belief in Christianity. The inclusion of “I believe...He descended into hell. On the third day he rose again,” in the Apostles Creed and “We believe...On the third day he rose again in fulfillment of the Scriptures” in the Nicene Creed are proof of this later more literal view.

    Devising a Literal Reading to Cover a Tradition

    The literalism of American NRMs (New Religious Movements) that spewed forth from the Second Great Awakening included a lack of academic scholarship which still plagues them today. Groups like the Jehovah’s Witnesses cannot honestly reconcile the lack of evidence of “three days” dead in a tomb with the tradition upon which Christianity was built, and therefore texts like Matthew 12:40 and John 2:19 get taught as if they are literal reports of the resurrection. As noted above, they are not.

    The Jewish tradition upon which Jonah built his parable of being in the belly of the fish for three days and linking it to being in Sheol is from Hosea 6:2. There the expression “three days” connected to being “raised up” merely means an expectation of “soon.” Of interest is that the mention of Jonah’s experience in the fish’s belly being likened to Sheol comes from the prayer found at Jonah 2:3-10. These verses were likely not written by Jonah himself but composed later by someone who might not have been aware of Jonah’s intentions to teach a moral lesson by means of a humorous and fanciful narrative.

    *Footnote: According to the NABRE about Matthew 12:40: “The sign was simply Jonah’s preaching to the Ninevites (Lk 11:30, 32), Matthew here adds Jonah’s sojourn in the belly of the whale for three days and three nights, a prefigurement of Jesus’ sojourn in the abode of the dead and, implicitly, of his resurrection.”--Italics added.

  • Half banana
    Half banana

    Crazyguy, I asked the same question myself five years ago and did some investigation. What else dies for three days? It is the sun which 'dies' for three days from the 21st December to the 24th. It stops at the same point of the horizon, setting and rising there for three days and three nights but when It rises again on the 25th December it has begun to move northwards again; otherwise described anciently as being "reborn". This was a cause for celebration; the re-birth of the sun.

    Just to get the astronomy right-- the setting point of the sun was a calendrical marker for the seasons for pre-literate agriculturalists possibly starting in the New Stone Age, (may be earlier) and going forward for some thousand years through the Bronze Age and into the Iron Age. Where else would you look to find what the date is without books or calendars? How else would you know when to sow particular crops? The position of the sunset on the horizon tells you. Furthest North is midsummer and midway are the equinoxes.

    In Autumn the position of sunset progressively moves southwards on the Western horizon until it slows down in its southern travel and stops altogether for three days. On the 25th December it begins to moves North once again. If you live on the equator this will not help you and neither will it be of use if you live in the Arctic. In between these geographical extremes you would have depended on this information for your farming and therefore your food. It would not be surprising to celebrate the turning of the seasons and clearly the feast and fast days of the ancient pagans were absorbed into the Bible and sanitised by early Christian Church. It's one reason why Jdubs have the memorial. . .

    Many of the Stone circle alignments (but not Stonehenge) even in the north of Europe eg Maeshowe in Orkney Scotland, are orientated for a solar alignment at sunrise on the 25th December. It was the moment to celebrate the return of the Sun, the rebirth of the Sun God who would bless the community again with light and growth and fertility in the fields and hence the continuation of life itself.

    In the Neolithic folk calendar Christmas day was central to the annual cycle of life to be followed three months later by the sacrificial death of the son of the Sun God at Easter.

    In Homer, Ulysses goes down to the underworld for three days, in fact all saviour and celestial heros die for three days as a mark or badge of the God-man. Jesus was described as doing the same so the listeners would know what character he was meant to be.

    Jesus is none other than a historicization of the folk tale of the journey of the Sun God as were all of his literary forebears, Dionysus, Attis, Horus, Adonis et al.

    It was the fact that early Christianity preached that this god-man Jesus had become a real breathing person, who had lived -- and died for three days and three nights and was resurrected according to the folk tales of old, which shocked the sensibilities of the educated Greeks and Romans to learn that they gullibly believed these outrageous impossibilities.

  • Crazyguy
    Crazyguy

    I realize the real reason for the story was the rising of the Sun Half banana on The vernal equinox when the days become longer then the nights, but was trying to figure out if there was a legitimate explanation to the three days he's supposedly dead in the Bible? The first poster Snowbird, said Wednesday through Saturday but people have used the Bible to blow up that idea too. Not sure if anyone can explain with out contradicting parts of the Bible the three days and nights he was supposedly dead.

  • snowbird
    snowbird

    I constructed the Wednesday through Saturday model using the four gospels.

    6pm Tuesday evening to 6pm Wednesday evening - Nisan 14, Passover - Jesus of Nazareth & Co ate evening meal on Tuesday night after which He was arrested, tried, and sentenced to death. He died at 3 pm on Wednesday, the 9th hour. His body was hurriedly placed in a new tomb so that the Passover could be observed. The women carefully noted where His body was laid because they knew it would be either Friday or Sunday before they could perform the customary anointing of It for burial.

    6pm Wednesday evening to 6 pm Thursday evening - Nisan 15, first day of Unleavened Bread - A High Sabbath, so called because it occurred same week as the regular Sabbath. One night, one day ...

    6 pm Thursday evening to 6 pm Friday evening - Nisan 16, Preparation Day for the weekly Sabbath. On Friday, women disciples prepared fragrant spices to anoint His body, then rested because of the Sabbath. Two nights, two days ...

    6pm Friday evening to 6 pm Saturday evening - Nisan 17, weekly Sabbath - Jesus of Nazareth arose at 6 pm, on Saturday. Three nights, three days ...

    6 pm Saturday evening to 6 pm Sunday evening - Nisan 18, first day of the week, early Sunday morning, the risen Jesus of Nazareth appeared to women disciples who had come to anoint His dead body, and to others as they walked along a road or sat in a locked room.

    This, I believe, is how it happened.

    Sylvia

  • David_Jay
    David_Jay

    @snowbird

    In reference to John 19:31: A "high Sabbath" is when a Jewish festival day of rest lands on a Saturday, meaning two Sabbaths are occurring at the same time.

    While I applaud your work, you mentioned the "high" or "great Sabbath" occurring from sundown Wednesday to sundown Thursday. That is impossible. Only when Nisan 15 lands on Shabbat or Saturday (sundown Friday to sundown Saturday) is it a "high Sabbath."

    Not all Jewish festivals have a day of rest added to them like Passover does (for example, Chanukah has no additional rest day so there is never a "high Sabbath" for that celebration). This year we Jews celebrated Passover (Nisan 15) on Monday April 10. We didn't have a high Sabbath with Passover this year.

    Next year, however, in 2018, Nisan 15 will land on Friday night, the same night Shabbat begins. That will be a Great or "high" Sabbath for us then. This was the same situation in the year when Jesus was crucified.

  • Simon
    Simon

    Jesus went to Tesco supermarket to buy Easter Eggs on Thursday, but they were sold out. He went again on Friday, but had to make do with some from the Shell garage on the way home instead. Finally, he thought "sod it" and bought some overpriced ones from M&S.

    I'm pretty sure that explains the 3 days and fits perfectly with the gospel account.

    Heck, if anything it makes more sense.

  • Half banana
    Half banana

    Actually Crazyguy, I was saying that the recurring motif in ancient literature of three and a half days for heros being dead or going down into the underworld, comes from the winter solstice when the Sun 'dies' and not from solar events the vernal equinox.

    The Easter time events are do with the sacrificial death of the son of the Sun God and his resurrection to heavenly glory but the trope of "three days dead" is carried over from the death and rebirth of the Sun in December.

    Myth does not follow logic and that is why Bible texts struggle to make sense of irrational folk tales by forcing some semblance of reality on them and worse still, claim them to be read as historical truth.

  • jwleaks
    jwleaks

    According to the bible Jesus was dead the equivelent of 0.5 spiritual seconds. How? The bible says that according to jehovah a thousand years is as one day. Therefore three days equals 0.5 seconds.

  • snowbird
    snowbird

    Thank you so much for that correction, David_Jay.

    You are absolutely right.

    Blessings.

    Sylvia

  • Crazyguy
    Crazyguy

    Half banana, the first mention of three days and three nights had to do with the story of Innana . She told her companion to wait that long for her to return from visiting her sister god of the underworld. When she didn't because she was killed by her sister the companion went for help.

    Innana was the queen of heaven the goddess of fertility and love etc. This story was all about how there's death and no growth during the fall and winter seasons. She was resurrected and others were made to take her place in the underworld during these non productive seasons.

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