I have a very dear friend who is a JW and I am trying to find a way to open her eyes and make her aware of the bulls**t they spew as "truth". I can sense a hint of doubt In her, but cannot openly talk with her about It. I gave her a copy of CofC, but she didn't read It and now she doesn't trust me.I need to find a way to open her eyes or at least get her thinking without actually mentioning her beliefs.she made a couple of comments that have stuck with me. One was when she said she wished she had never become a JW, but knowing what she knows now, she won't leave. Another was that she longed for the chance to have never known of It. and lastly, If she had any doubt she would leave. This frustrates me to no end and worries the hell out of me. I can't go the direct route with her. I tried and am basically being shunned because of It. She's only 25 and was baptized at 15 and she deserves a better life than this.All she knows Is guilt and fear. If anyones got a suggestion, now is the time. You can check my older posts for the whole story and my email Is open.
Need Help Badly!
Sorry to hear that she didn't read CoC (like a good dubbie) and unfortunately has closed her mind to what you may say about the WTBTS. So chill.
Emphasize her interests in life and help her to learn to just express her own ideas. Slowly this may help her see that she is being "controlled".
There are a lot of us here trying to figure out how to crack the JW shell. Lots of luck. Keep us informed about what you do.
ps, my hubby got me to start thinking by pointing out the lack of love and discrimination the wtbts sprews. He had started to read CoC and kept siting examples of injustices, just ever so slightly and weeks apart, so that I wouldn't get suspicious.
Hmmm...w/o actually mentioning her beliefs....hmmm....Last Friday night I watched part of 20/20 You know the guy with the "Gimme a Break" stuff? John Stossel? He told a story that smacked in the face of JW teachings w/o ever mentioning them. Here goes:
Northwest Airlines is run by an elderly lady w/ a fun spirit. She has the stewardesses on the flights recite dumb little songs and poems. ETC....The passengers get a kick out of it, probably because it is so unexpected and lighthearted. On one particular flight, the stewardess recited the poem, "Eeeny, Meeny, Miney, Mo Take your seat...we have to go". Not long after that flight Northwest was hit with a lawsuit. It was started by two black women who read a book called The Origins of Words and Sayings. The suit contended that the original poem was this way, "Eeeny Meeny Miney Mo, catch a nigger by the toe". The women claimed that the entire flight stunk of racial discrimination after that lil poem was read. Stossel went out and asked children what that poem meant to them and they told him it was just a way to pick who has the next turn for a game. He asked white adults and they said the same thing. He asked black adults and they said the same thing. He found no one with a problem with Eeeny Meeny Miney Mo...
The point is sublte but it hit me hard. The dubs are like that book about origins. No one is really calling on evil spirits just because they have wind chimes on their porch. No one is being a pagan just because they give a kiss under the mistletoe....on and on it goes.......If those women never read that book, they might have chuckled on the flight and had a nice day.Also just because they read that book, doesn't mean anyone else has. The witnesses purposefully try to make people feel guilty about things they don't have to feel anything about. The origin of something may very well be wrong but it is how it is used today that matters to one's conscience. The wt tries to seare consciences of the innocent. How is that good or loving? dj
DJ I saw that 20/20 too and it was interesting.
Mackey, I agree with onacruse; if she did not want to read Cof C, you may have to bide your time for now.
I've never been a dub, but have a friend who is one. We've talked religion over the years. This friend converted when they were in their early 20's, having lost a loved one and wanting to understand the scriptures. At this vulnerable time in their life, the JW's came by and started 'explaining' the Bible. My friend swallowed it hook, line and sinker. I asked this friend, what if a bible educated baptist or luthern had come to your door and started teaching you all the things that you didn't understand, wouldn't that have made an impression and wouldn't you then have gotten your answers of their 'truth' and thereby become an adherent of their religion? This really got my friend to stop and think, but not enough to challenge JW doctrine. I also said that "God wants you to be happy and to find the truth in all things, and wouldn't be upset if you started to check things out." I could see the wheels turning on that one too. Who knows, in their own right time, I suppose. Good luck.
and lastly, If she had any doubt she would leave
In general, most people have doubts about almost everything, including her. In most cases people are 'free' to challenge their doubts. You could tell her if there is a shade of doubt, she should follow the admonishion of the scriptures and "Seek and ye shall find, knock and it shall be open unto you".... that way, she's following 'Jehovah'.
I'll tell you what I told my ex-wife that made her question the dubs. When I decided to leave, I spewed all the things I thought that were wrong, but most she excused away. The only thing that stuck and actually planted seeds of doubt in her head had to do with control. She always felt like an independant person, so I guess its no surprise.
Every time she mentioned anything about doing things she wanted but couldn't, I asked her why she couldn't. Because I can't was her answer all the time. I asked her if its because she would get in trouble with the elders, and she responded yes. I just laughed and said you are 22 years old, you cant get in trouble(Unless its illegal). They can't kick you out of the house or anything. There is nothing scriptually wrong with it, why are you going to let some people tell you what you can and can't do when they have nothing to do with your life. (Just 1 example of the things I said, but all along the same lines)
Well, I didn't change what she believes, but I helped her see the WTS as who they are. She doesn't see them as the Mother Org that is the only true religion. Where ever she goes in life, I know she won't be in the clutches of the Borg and it makes me feel good.
I guess what I'm saying is use the techniques of persuasion they teach you to say at the door. Find something that interests them or is a concern for them and let them see the truth about that facet of the Borg. She was independant, so I showed her that she was being controlled.
This is a lot like the lottery. You got to be real patient. And there's a good chance you won't be a winner (even if you do manage to help her out).
There are a lot of great people out there, don't waste too much time standing around and buying tickets. Set a date for cutting you loses.
All the best, Wheels
For some simple scriptural points, see my post on Beliefs about the Memorial
Don't get involved in long, technical points or arguments. As the organization continues to quietly decay, their eyes
may be opened.
I baffled my JW relatives by asserting that the organization has no future because it is losing its young people
and contributions. The experience of Witness kids leaving or getting df'd is so universal now, few can debate about it.
Nor can they deny the loss of subscriptions, food at assemblies, most hard cover books, etc. Often, these simple
realities can open their eyes - if not now, then later, as things get worse for the Watchtower Society.