# Numeracy

by jws 13 Replies latest jw experiences

• ##### jws

I recently saw on a website where a guy I know posted a link to a video by Graham Hancock. Now this guy is a nutjob kind of like the ancient alien guys. But he believes there was some ancient advanced civilization, possibly equal to our modern one, that mingled with our ancient civilizations.

So in this video that was posted, he is obsessed with various measurements in the Great Pyramid of Giza. This pyramid has been a fascination of crackpots for years. Charles Taze Russell used various measurements inside the pyramid in inches to represent years and to "prove" his year predictions correct. Nevermind he had to transpose some digits and his drawings never showed the numbers for the ones he changed. This pyramid somehow proved the bible correct according to his interpretation of it. Another nutjob named Carl Munck also thought the location of the great pyramid should be the location of true 0 longitude for his wacky calculations. And his calculations are equally as foolish for the gullible. Why all this fascination for purveyors of woo-woo with this pyramid, I don't know.

Well, Graham Hancock is at it. He says that if you take the height of the pyramid (481 feet) and multiply it by 43,200, you get the radius of the earth. And if you measure the base perimiter of the pyramid (about 3024 feet) by the same 43,200, you get the circumference of the earth. Wow! How could the ancients have known the exact size of the earth?

I wish people weren't so gullible and had a little knowledge of math and numbers.

The thing is yes, the dimensions of height and base perimeter of the pyramid do have relationships to each other. Basically the base perimeter is the height times 2 times the number pi (3.1415926536...) So basically you can take the height of the pyramid and multiply it or divide it by some number to get the the radius of ANY other sphere. The earth, the moon, a basketball, a soccer ball, a baseball, a Magic 8 ball, a cue ball, or the ball at Epcot Center. And you take that same multiplier/divisor and use it on the base perimeter and you get the circumference of that sphere. It's not magic, it's math.

So, Hancock tells you there's no way the ancient Egyptians knew the dimensions of the earth without help from an advanced lost civilization. I'm sure others say ancient aliens. But this isn't proof. Because with the right multiplier/divisor, you can scale it to ANY sphere.

IF you want to show a correlation, then show me the multiplier/divisor (ie scale) FIRST.

Hancock works backwards. We have the measurements of the earth in our modern world, so he can divide. And Hancock comes up with this magic number, 43,200. Why that scale? Why that multiplier? Well, says Hancock, the earth slowly wobbles on it's axis. And over a period of 72 years, it wobbles one degree. And 43,200 is a multiple of 72. Problem solved. Really?

But 43,200 is also divisible by 2. I have 2 feet, 2 hands. Why not 2? It's divisible by 10. I have 10 fingers and 10 toes. Why not pick 43,200 because it's divisible by 10?

He is working backwards. He's starting with what we know to be the size of the earth and dividing the dimensions of the pyramid to get numbers. And then searching for natural phenominon to explain those numbers. That's not how you do it. You look at their evidence and show me where they clearly indicated their pyramid was on a 1 to 43,200 scale to the size of the earth.

What's more, 43,200 isn't even the actual multiplier. Depending on the height of the pyramid (480.6 feet or rounded to 481 feet) the multiplier should be something like 43,409, not 43,200. And that's NOT a multiple of 72. To which Hancock would say the difference is only a little bit. 3932 miles by his calculation to what should be a radius of 3951. Only 19 miles difference. But the fact is it's wrong.

To demonstrate the absurdity of these lunatic calculations, I used the same calculations to PROVE beyond a shadow of a doubt that the dimensions of the great pyramid represented a baseball. So it was obviously time-traveling baseball fans from our future that influenced the building of the great pyramid.

Because if you DIVIDE the dimensions of the pyramid by 4030, you get the radius and the circumference of a baseball. Why 4030? Because baseball is played 26 weeks of the year. And 4030 is a multiple of 26. How could ancient Egyptians have known the size of a baseball in a game that was invented thousands of years in the future? Amazing! I'll bet your mind is blown right now because you never considered time-traveling baseball fans, but can see now that the evidence is irrefutable and that's the ONLY way these numbers can truly be interpreted.

What's more, look at the base of the pyramid. Is that not the shape of a baseball diamond? What's more, who did the Egyptians worship? Ra - the sun god. So Ra is more than man. Like an extra man, like 2 men. And Ra is the sun god who comes out during the day. So Ra is like a double man during the day. Doubleday. And Doubleday invented baseball. It all fits. Time travelling baseball fans obviously greatly influenced ancient Egypt. Not only in regards to pyramid dimensions, but also as to their religion.

Hancock is also amazed that the pyramid aligns with true north. True north is perpendicular to the rotation of the earth. As opposed to magnetic north. And there's no way ancient people could have known what true north is. Because it would be perpendicular to where the sun rises and the sun sets. How could ancients with their primitive intellects possibly know where the sun rises and where it sets? Oh yeah, they could look at the sky. They could take some sticks and mark shadows. There are a bunch of different ways. But I guess that's too complicated for ancient people.

Carl Munck was another nutjob. He took a look at Stonehenge and said it originally had 60 stones in a circle counting uprights and lintels. And since it was a circle, you multiply by 360 degrees and get 21,600. Well, if you take the "precise" latitude of Stonehenge (51 degrees, 10 minutes, 42.352941 seconds) and multiply each of those numbers together, you get 21,600. Wow! How could the ancients have known exactly where to build Stonehenge in terms of latitude without help from advanced civilizations and/or aliens? Except, this isn't 1980 when this guy originally wrote this. Now we have google maps. And if we plug this in, we a point outside the circle. And if you also plug in his calculations with longitude, I think you get a parking lot.

Look at the seconds. It's SO precise. If you're going to be that precise, you'd better be spot-on to make your point. He didn't start with actual coordinates. No, he started with 21600. Divided by 51. Then divided by 10. And calculated a minute value. You can basically do this with locations all around the globe. Take 21600 divide it by the "hours", the "minutes" and come up with the seconds. I used the same calculations to show that a parking lot in downtown Dallas could yield the number 21600. Yet for some reason it's not given the same reverence and hasn't gotten nearly the tourist traffic as Stonehenge. People walk by it without even paying any attention. It's as if they don't know how significant it is. I wonder why.

BTW, the actual latitude of Stonehenge is 51 degrees, 10 minutes, and 43.8 seconds, not 42.4 seconds. And if you multiply those together, you get 22,338, not 21,600. Oops. But if this was the 80's and you had a map that even showed latitude, you'd probably have to guesstimate the minutes and seconds or at least the seconds and you'd think Munck was spot-on. But like I say, we have google maps now with satellite imagery.

It's the transitive property of multiplication. You can swap around the numbers and still get the same result. Like 10 degrees, 51 minutes instead of vice-versa. Or you can change the numbers like the 51 to a 50 and divide out. It's all basic, basic mutiplication.

But, alas, in some places that doesn't work. The hours and minutes of the lattitude ranges. Hours from 0-90, minutes from 0-60, and seconds from 0-60. So some locations you can't just multiply out to get 21,600 because, for instance, the combination of hours and minutes are too low. Munck has a solution to this. He picks different numbers. Now it has to multiply out to 2660 or something. Why this change, oh, he has some explaination as to how he came up with it, but not as to why a different product is applicable to this site vs another.

There are numbers all around us. The date, the month, the year, the number of feet or inches from one thing to another. Whether it's measured in metric or standard. Or you could use one of the various scales for a cubit used by different civilizations. And of course rounding off pesky little things that throw off your calculations. There's the number of slabs in the sidewalk. The circumference of the earth, the moon, or any other thing in space. Or the number of planets in our galaxy. Point being, I can use numbers and pick and choose whatever I want and play some games with math and come up with whatever results I want. I could have them predict my birth, my phone number.

The Jewish Colonization Association was formed on September 11th, 1891. Exactly 110 years later, the Twin Towers were destroyed by Muslim terrorists. We know Jews and Muslims don't get along. Each of the twin towers had 110 floors. 110 years, 110 floors. Jewish Association, Muslim attackers. Surely this isn't just coincidence.

I can do this all day long. I wonder how much scum like Alex Jones would pay me to write conspiracy theories for him?

People, get some numeracy. And logical thinking skills.

• ##### Simon

Yes, finding 'patterns' and correlation in numbers after the fact isn't difficult and doesn't prove anything. You can also find 'amazing' messages in books by taking every n-th word, it's just recognizing something though, not a prediction.

Lots of things (like time and buildings) were based on astronomical observations so it's little wonder than working backwards points to values to-do with those things. It's fascinating and fun though.

Also, the ancients were pretty smart. They knew how large the earth was back in Egypt:

https://gizmodo.com/how-the-circumference-of-earth-was-accurately-estimated-1493009177

• ##### daviddan

hello human, what you wrote I do not like and what I have seen by far is hate speech or negative things about Jehovah's witnesses,

by any chance did you learn all these things from you tube video and online on wiki? if so most of it is wrong,

i have a read book about revelation, and there is another book i read about drama of creation, and it talked nothing about pyramids, also sorry for my spelling.

• ##### daviddan

i know that what you saying would be true, and I know it would not be that hard, also the 9/ 11 thing wasnt caused by jews, it was caused by the goverment they wanted ti to happen there is a whole video about it, my brother who is an athiest show me a video about zeitgeist or what ever its called , i even heard on the radio about it too about 1 world goverment, it was their plan and more

• ##### jws

daviddan, not familiar with you and whether you're just trying to be funny or not.

Thy Kingdom Come by CT Russell has the pyramid stuff:

So, then, if we measure backward down the "First Ascending Passage" to its junction with the "Entrance Passage," we shall have a fixed date to mark upon the downward passage. This measure is 1542 inches, and indicates the year BC 1542, as the date at that point. Then measuring down the "Entrance Passage" from that point, to find the distance to the entrance of the "Pit," representing the great trouble and destruction with which this age is to close, when evil will be overthrown from power, we find it to be 3416 inches, symbolizing 3416 years from the above date, BC 1542. This calculation shows AD. 1874 as marking the beginning of the period of trouble; for 1542 years BC plus 1874 years AD. equals 3416 years. Thus the Pyramid witnesses that the close of 1874 was the chronological beginning of the time of trouble such as was not since there was a nation -- no, nor ever shall be afterward. And thus it will be noted that this "Witness" fully corroborates the Bible testimony on this subject...

Yes, Simon, ancient Egypt did know the circumference of the Earth when an ancient Greek mathematician calculated it there. And that's a good point. Yet, that was around 200 BC, give or take. But the Pyramid at Giza was finished around 2560 BC.

That shows that this notion that the ancients all thought the world was flat is wrong and shows that they were intelligent enough to even calculate the approximate size of the earth. Many underestimate them and give them no respect.

However, some 2300 years before Eratosthenes, we assume we didn't know the dimensions of the earth when this pyramid was built. Either from our own calculations or from calculations of lost advanced civilizations and/or space aliens. So how could they build a pyramid to a scale of X when they didn't know what that scale should be? And they left no indication as to "if you multiply the base perimeter by X, you get the size of the earth". No evidence they told us what X was. So there's no evidence any correlation was intended. Which I'm not saying you're implying. Hancock is though. Hancock is inventing the scale of X in hindsight.

My son, when he played with Legos, could build a tower and if at age 3 he told me it's 1/2530th the size of Willis Tower, I'd be amazed if I measured it and it was. Because he's 3 and he doesn't know the size of Willis Tower or how to even measure what he built. But I can't have him build a tower and some time later I measure it and compute it's 1/2530th the size of Willis tower. How did he know that? You've got to provide the scale first to prove the correlation and that's the wool Hancock is pulling over people's eyes.

• ##### dropoffyourkeylee

It is worth noting that the 'Thy Kingdom Come' quote refers to the Great Pyramid as the 'Witness'. In fact, the first place that any Watchtower literature mentioned the name 'Jehovah's Witness', it was referring to the Great Pyramid, which was 'God's Witness' in Egypt ( a reference to Isaiah). It was only when Rutherford needed to come up with an alternate explanation of what 'God's Witness' was that he came up with the name of Jehovah's Witnesses. It all started with the Great Pyramid.

LOL

• ##### GrreatTeacher

Lee, good point. I think that a lot of people weren't aware that the original "witness" was the great pyramid.

Jws, I used to think that "144,000" was such a random, mystical number as a child.

Then, I learned my multiplication tables, found out that 144 is the square of 12, and was seriously deflated. In fact, that number is so common that it has its own name: a "gross."

I also agree that numeracy is important! Just as important as literacy!

• ##### waton

It is said that you do not understand a theory if you cam not express it in numbers. So: By the way: what is the difference between Numeracy and Numerology?

There is great stuff in astronomy that is not directly linked to outworking of laws:

The bode "law"

The beauty of numbers in astronomy is, that it is an exact science, and facts behind the data are in existence since millions of years. hard to fudge.

• ##### GrreatTeacher

Waton, numeracy is being "literate" with numbers.

Numerology is some nonsense where numbers have some kind of mystical significance.

• ##### Crazyguy

Not sure if Graham Hancock is using a random number as a divisor, I believe it’s pie rounded up. Anyway I’m not sure but some of the things about the pyramid are very intriguing.

Graham was one of the first to basically state that he believes that there was earlier civilizations before the Sumerians and the Egyptians. Well there seems to evidence that he was right. Civilizations in India have been found that look to date older. Sunken cities off the coast of India and also remains found around an old dried up river bed seem to indicate he was right. Remains found in Turkey, Iran and Egypt found in the last 20 years again seem to indicate he was right. More and more evidence keeps popping up that indicate humans have been around and able to build things going back much further then 5-6-8000 years.