The 144,000

johnathanseagull

Hi all, am I right in thinking that the WTS teach that the "acceptance door" for being an annoited closed in 1935 or have I got mixed up on this?......

Buster

1935 sounds right. But the key point is that the number was sealed at some point in the past - far enough in the past so that the Remnant have been elderly for 40 years.

Let me play a hunch and guess where you are going - How is it that we have 8500 or so Remnant partaking today?

- Buster

Hi Buster........you are indeed correct, I'm sooner or later going to instigate a conversation with my Dub family, not an argument but an observation say and want to use this, Ray Franz wrote something on this but Im away from home and havent got the book, it said something along the lines of since the death of the apostles, on average only 70 ave been accepted in to this class, based on the 144,000, minus how many are alive today, divided by nearly 2000 years, I'm thinking this statement will at last get them thinking.

J Gull

johnathanseagull

Buster.........to clarify an average of 70 a year

Buster

I like this:

Partakers in the early 70s: 10,000 or so. They were quite elderly then. As a matter of fact, their age was one of the signs of the end for us.

Percentage that could possibly still be alive thirty years later: 25% (maybe): 2,500 alive, 7,500 dead

Partakers in last couple years: 8,500 or so

We need 6000 NEW partakers in the last thrity years: 2500 from the 70s + 6000 NEW = 8500 today

Now that number was sealed. But in the inimitable JW rationalization (I'll bet this came directly from F Franz) mode, they are all human, and sometimes they can fall away. In such a case they would need to be replaced to keep the number 144k.

So, of the 7500 or so Remnant that have died between then and now, 6000 have been replaced.

Now this is my favorite point: In order to make room for replacements, 6000 of the 7500 dead must have fallen away before their death. For those keeping score at home: that's 80% of the Annointed, that were already elderly, sinned badly enough to be dropped from the heavenly hopefull and had to be replaced.

butalbee

Alrighty then.

RunningMan

As I understand it, the close of the "high calling" occurred in 1881, 1915, 1931, and finally, 1935.

1935 is the official date for the sealing of the 144,000. However, the society has printed a number of articles recently that have studiously avoided making this statement. They have just not mentioned it. The most recent one was in the new "Worship the True God" book, that simply eliminated the chapter on the annointed.

So, I suspect they are distancing themselves from it, and will eventually say that "many years ago, it was thought..."

This has got to be one of their most embarassing flaws of the current day.

Navigator

My wife, who was born in 1936, decided that she was one of the 144,000 in 1972.

johnathanseagull

Gosh , thanks for all your replies, keep em a comming , I need all the understanding I can

J Gull

Tashawaa

"Now this is my favorite point: In order to make room for replacements, 6000 of the 7500 dead must have fallen away before their death. For those keeping score at home: that's 80% of the Annointed, that were already elderly, sinned badly enough to be dropped from the heavenly hopefull and had to be replaced." - Quote from BUSTER

I don't know how to do those neat little boxes for quotes... anyhoo, my two cents.

I once read that a df'd JW with the heavenly calling, if re-instated wouldn't revert to being of the Great Crowd (earthly hope), but that they would still maintain their original calling.

Hmmmm, I wonder if any of the "newly" appointed ever got demoted.

The 144,000

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