The whole thing reminds me of the "evil or stupid...?" post that I wrote. The governing body shouldn't have a say, in the first place, regarding funerals. They don't have any family anyway, how can they relate? They take the spirit out of a somber event and they turn it into an infomercial for the resurrection. I can't understand why anyone, even if they are a JW in "good standing" would want to submit themselves to this humiliation after death.
WT6-15-02 ?from readers-funerals for suicides
by LyinEyes 28 Replies latest jw friends
-
-
Gordy
In 1996 suffering from severe acute clinical depression I attempted suicide. I took an overdose. I survived. I spent six weeks in a physchiatric hospital, the hospital staff where not surprised when they found out I was a JW, seems JW's are regular patients.. During that period only one elder came to see me. Usually they would bring my wife to the hospital, but sit in the car outside waiting. When back home still no elder would visit, brothers and sisters also stopped visiting, which hurt my wife as she felt she was being punished. I was "privately" reproved and removed as a Ministerial servant. Their whole attitude was to keep it as quiet as possible that a JW had tried to kill himself. Their answer to it all was to attend meetings and go out on field service. Can imagine feeling the way I did knocking on someones door and telling them how wonderful everything will be in the future. Eight months of trying to get through each day without wanting to throw myself under the next truck. My wife tells me I must leave home. Later I discovered this was because the Elders had advised her that I was a "spiritual danger" to the family. This is just what a suicdal depressive needs to hear. I had to move out my home, not only that but to another congregation in the next town so that I was not attending the same congregation as my family. I continued to attend meetings each week, but found the field ministry very difficult still. I received no "shepherding" calls from elders, apart from being greeted at the Kingdom Hall that was as far as it went in support. They seem to hope that I would quietly fade away. Having expected support from "Jehovah's loving organisation" I was shaken by the way they did react. This started me to have doubts about the WT. I was given a copy of "Crisis of Conscience" by a JW (who himself has since left). That book opened the floodgates so to speak. For the next two years I read everything for and against the WT. Looked on the Internet came across site like this one and Freeminds and others. I realised that many where expressing thinigs that in times past that I to had had doubts about in WT teaching. Anyway to cut a long story short. In August 1999 I attended my last meeting at the Kingdom Hall. I expected a visit from elders, didn't get one, not even a phone call. I gave them till the memorial in 2000, not even an invite to that. By now my wife, from whom I was separated had stopped speaking to me, and still doesn't. In September 2001 two elders called to see me, I wasn't home. So I wrote to them saying it had taken them two years to come and see me, it showed the depth of concern for me. I disassociated at the same time. THis meant that my wife cannot have any contact with me and my two daughters (25 & 18), who are JW's can have no contact either. There is a lot more that happened buit i would be writng for ages on here, it was meant to be short anyway.
It makes me think that the JW's who do succeed in killing themselves are the lucky ones, judging my my experience and others in the WT.
-
LyinEyes
Gordy, that is one of the saddest stories I have ever heard. It is heartbreaking. Maybe because I know word for word what you said is true, that is how my mom was treated so many times.
You are here, and there is so much you can do. Your daughters are young , they still believe what they are told, we all understand that , we did it too.
I hope in time you and your daughters can find your way back together. I wish I could tell them what I would give just to tell my mother how sorry I am for the way she was treated her whole life. Just one more chance to laugh with her, to put my head in her lap and listen to her dreams, the dreams of the life she wanted some day. How she would go into detail of the kind of house and horses she wanted... now these dreams are just treasured reminders of a person who loved life. That is the way I want to remember her. But still I am angry , not at her anymore, but for self righteous people who think they should tell you how to serve God and live your life. They will answer someday.
Don't give up on your girls, Gordy, maybe make it your life's mission to find a way to help them out of the cult of JW. I swear, as I am sitting here right now a year ago, I would NEVER had said proudly .. "I AM AN APOSTATE!!!!!". I would have rather died first. But look what the right time, the right words, did for me,,,,,,,,,,, it freed me . I am still getting over alot of issues, that takes time after you have been a JW your whole life. But I am on a whole different road now and I wouldnt change it for the world. So don't put it out of your mind that you can't reach your girls, just be more clever than the WT , use their own material against them. That is how I was "won" over.
I feel a different peace about my mom since I left JW a year ago. I feel I understand why she was so lonely, depressed and alot of other families issues I blocked out of my mind. I guess I couldnt admit to myself that the religion I was in was to blame, for I loved Jehovah so much.
Things can look so bad, and man, you were done very wrong, there is no shame in admitting how much they screwed your life up, they are still tearing families apart.
I hope you fight, fight with all your might to win your daughters back. Be patient and I am sure they miss and love you. I remember being that age, I didnt understand anything, like I thought I did.
I truly feel if my mom would have , had internet access, some prozac, real therepy and at least one good apostate friend, she could have made it. She was really a fighter in so many ways, and I feel maybe she is with me and I feel the fire in my heart that she does. I can't explain it , but I feel I have to speak out. Gordy, make your voice known and heard and don't let the WT take anymore of your life, and thanks for sharing your story. One of many who do care, Dede
-
rocky220
Dear InquiryMan; You failed to see the point I was making.....I was putting no one down., I merely pointed out that in order to make a fair, and appropriate assesment in suicide, or sex abuse cases for that matter.....the Bible isn't the end all and be all in seeking resolution let alone help in these cases, like depression.....I know of elders that have decided that a member is either demon posessed or just need to pray more, or go out in service more......no, they need psychiatric evaluation and medication management...do you see now?......I dont care what they do for a living, just recognize, if an elder has no psychiatric knowledge or credentials, basing the Bible to a chemical inbalance in the brain isn't going to get it......Get it?????..........rocky220
-
Pistoff
DeDe:
You have brought up a very core issue for all of us, active, anti's and otherwise:
The society cares NOT ONE WHIT about a person's mental health, no matter what they say. They feel, if you are depressed, you are not studying enough. It is a catch-22: healthy people are not depressed; jw's are among the healthiest of people, ergo, they ARE NOT DEPRESSED except when they are slacking. How many times have you read "experiences" of someone who was depressed who "cured" themself by just getting to more meetings, or studying more, or more service?
The implication is that ALL depressed people are slackers, and that is CRIMINAL THINKING. I don't know the depth of your sorrow over your mother, but I share in your anger at uncaring elders, CO's and esp. the WRITING STAFF and GB at Bethel who keep pushing out this totalitarian line about depression. I had two in my cong within 2 years, very zealous pubs, who killed themselves because of depression. The brother who gave the talk was happy to say that it is up to Jehovah, as we don't know what the circumstances were for the suicide. WHAT THE HELL?? Who kills themself if they see a happy future? NO ONE HEALTHY completes suicide; why can't they just love the victim, and comfort the survivors, and shut the hell up about what they think about suicide.
I have two sons who have had bouts with depression, ALL CAUSED BY INABILITY TO MEET THE BEHAVIOR REQUIREMENTS OF THE old gray men in brooklyn.
Thank God I still have them with me; they both have attempted. I am in the slow process of helping them to deprogram.I am sorry for your loss, dede.
-
Pistoff
dede:
I said I don't know the depth of your sorrow over your mother; what I meant is that it is impossible for me to know how much it hurts, I am not in your shoes. you have my sympathy and thoughts.
Gordy:
WELCOME!!!! You are in the right place. We love you here, not matter what your past. We share your pain in losing the "truth" and your joy in learning the real truth. NO ONE deserves to be treated the way you were treated; this is not God's way of loving.
I am glad you are here. -
JT
LYIN EYES......What do you expect from window washers, janitors, joe blows without any psychological degrees or credentials????
#########
excellent point and so many times i see poster vent thier anger at the men called elders as if one would expect a group of guys with a resume like the above to do something.
Imagine if someone went to a real psychologist building and each week the person met with the person in the Mailroom to discuss thier issues- what would one expect to get in terms of help
this is the reason why the jw are so dangerous, they put all kinds of fools in teh cockpit of folks lives to steer them in the proper direction of life
jw put it best --elders are untrained volunteers and we see the tragic result of such
Imagine how bad it is for jw who are in let's say a third world congo or even here in the usa in a spanish congo where all elders all cut grass for a living -- now a spanish sister has to seek advice from these guys, while there is nothing wrong with doing lawn service work to provide for ones home
IT DAMN SHOW DON'T MAKE YOU NOW QUALIFIED TO OFFER MENTAL MEDICAL ADVICE
I look back on my life as an elder and it scares the Sh!t out of me in terms of the advice i gave to folks on EVERY ISSUE IN THIER LIVES
i had no biz or qualifications to do so, but as an elder it is pounded into your head that YOU ARE EQUIPED FOR EVERY GOOD WORK
and this is pounded into the heads of publishers and that is why this sister along with millions of others CONTINUE TO GO BACK AGAIN AND AGAIN TO SEE THE CHEESE CRACKER MEN
HOW SAD
-
Room 215
And maybe the most ironic thing about this 06/15/02 article is that it actually represents a liberalization of their previous policy.
-
justhuman
The Watchtower cares only to give the perfect image to the world. Specially when they declare that JW are happy people. Through my experience all this years I know that most of JW suffer from mental problems.
So God knows that we are Humans. Jesus was here and He knows thay feeling. If someone commits suicide because of mental problems or sickness HE knows and will forgive.