To You Know and other pro-JWs who are posting here

by sunshineToo 34 Replies latest jw friends

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  You Know

  SUNSHINE 2

  If these "apostates" didn't make this much of publicity, do you think anyone would pay attention to the molestation policy which I didn't know until I saw Dateline.

  My point was that the Dateline expose is not going to prevent men from to evil things to children. But, it seems to me that heightened awareness about the issue is a good thing. The best way to deal with the two witness issue is to just call the cops and let them sort it out. I think the friends will be much less hesitant to do that now with all this mess out in the open.

  Icannot honestly say you are wrong or right because I'm a mere human being who cannot forsee the future. I just hate to see the people being misled, pressured and condamned by the JWs just because they (people like Bill and others) pointed out their (the JWs') dirty laundry. There might be more victims within the organization who might be too young to act alone. Unless the WTS gets punished by the court of law severly, I don't think anyone would pay attention to those hidden victims.

  The best court of law though is Jehovah's. He can get to the heart of the problem. He can destroy the abusers and set things right with the victims. Anything short of that is just bandaid stuff.

  I was so upset when I read the JW Zone thread. I also read their thread on the Canadian girl who needed blood tranfusion. What they said about her father made me so angry. I guess it was his sin for loving his daughter too much.

  These are life and death dramas that can whip up our passions and indignation. But, like I said, they are a mere sideshow to the greater issues and you shouldn't allow them to sidetrack you. Remember the proverb that says that "mere oppression can make a wise one act crazy"?

  Sigh......I guess I'm really an apostate. May God have mercy on me.

  Yes, it is possible. Remember the account about David's sin with Bathsheba? God's punishment for David was that Jehovah was going to allow his family to go berserk. Remeber Absalom even took over the throne from his father and David and his entourage were forced to live as fugitives. There was this guy Shemei who was walking along beside David and his family as they fled Jerusalem and he was calling down evil on David and throwing rocks at him. Joab wanted to take his head off but David restrained him and said that it was part of Jehovah's punishment. Later though when David was restored to the throne Shimei fell at David's feet and begged for forgiveness, which David granted, with one stipulation. The point is, that when Jehovah punishes his anointed ones for their sins then it may be possible for ones like yourself to be forgiven if you are so inclined to ask. I think as long as you don't go completely over the edge like a lot of apostates have done that you may really appreciate how Jehovah deals with this mess and sets things straight. / You Know

  Edited by - You Know on 7 August 2002 15:58:40
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  William Penwell

  Fred,

  You are correct not many in the 3rd world countries have access to a PC but most people here in Canada and the US either have access or can get access to a PC. I know myself now before I would get involved with anything whither it is a religious or business proposition, I would research them first on the Internet.

  Will
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  cruzanheart

  The problem, You Know, with your idea that thanks to Dateline there will be greater awareness of the child abuse problem is that the Society is doing everything possible to silence and discredit those brave people who made the problem public. And anyone who listens to them (according to the September 15 Watchtower, we're "guileless" - what a condescending way to say "stupid"!). Most of the Witnesses I've talked to didn't even know about the Dateline program! 2 Peter 2:2 sticks in my mind as applicable to this situation: "because of their loose conduct the way of the truth will be spoken of abusively" (might not have quoted that correctly, but that's the gist of it). Doesn't say they're going to change, though. I think we're seeing an apostasy within the organization akin to the one that occurred in the first century after the apostles died. And as for Jehovah using the nation of Israel as his chosen people even though they were sacrificing children at the temple, nowhere does it say that every good Israelite went to the temple during those times. Personally, I would have avoided it, as I am presently avoiding the meetings at the Kingdom Hall, on the grounds that it's dangerous for my children's health and not a proper way to worship a loving, merciful God.
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  hillary_step

  At the risk of throwing this thread off-topic, for which I apologize in advance, I wish to ask You Know a question if I may.

  Your answers, both here and in the past, show very clearly where you think the WTS might be in five years time YK, but let me ask, where do you think you will be?

  Best regards - HS
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  Crazy151drinker

  APOSTATE YOUKNOW

  My point was that the Dateline expose is not going to prevent men from to evil things to children]

  This, once again is false. 1st: By exposing these evil people and encouraging witnesses to go to the police, the molestors will go to jail and they will no longer be able to abuse. 2nd: If the Dateline expose forces the WT to turn over the 27,000 names then that is 27,000 people who will be punished an no longer be able to abuse kids. Stop protecting the WT Apostate. You say that it is just a worldly org that is straying from God, if you truely believe that then stop sticking up for it.
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  Satanus

  The best court of law though is Jehovah's. He can get to the heart of the problem. He can destroy the abusers and set things right with the victims. Anything short of that is just bandaid stuff.

  It's a good thing that miilions of people for thousands of years have been doing bandaide stuff, and not waiting on jehovah. Jehovah, of course, is a no show. More people are waking to the fact that jehovah is a lost cause. Hence bill bowen, panorama, the internet, the us constitution, the un, etc etc.

  Jehovah's best court of law has been in adjournment since anyone can remember. Maybe he's still trying to reach his own heart. He didn't show much heart in the ot.

  SS
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  You Know

  Hillary's Step

  Your answers, both here and in the past, show very clearly where you think the WTS might be in five years time YK, but let me ask, where do you think you will be?

  If I am still alive then and counted worthy I would expect to be alongside the brothers of Christ who will at some point be in various stages of incarceration, nakedness, homelessness, and starvation, and otherwise humilated. / You Know
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  YoursChelbie

  But, the solution is that Christ and his angels are charged with removing all things that cause stumbling and all persons doing lawlessness. That indicates that we need a super human solution to the evils afflicting us.

  SunshineToo, I'm familiar with the reasons you left the WTS. You ARE NOT an apostate in the sense that YOU KNOW refers to apostates; You DO NOT "use" the child abuse issue because you have any ulterior motives or for your own PERSONAL AGENDA. IT IS YOU KNOW Who needs the mercy of God. As well as people like him who knowingly continue to support an organization that has brought shame to God's name by its actions.

  the Silentlambs are being exploited by apostates to further their ends

  "YOU KNOW" uses the term apostate to refer to anyone who has left the WTS and uses the faults and crimes commited by the WTS for some "agenda." That's fine, Bobby is entitled to his OPINION.

  I'm going to teach you something you don't know---without my head covered--- mr. YOU "KNOW": I have NO agenda, I am sick and disgusted by all the lies of the WTS which you so blindly support. I have been stumbled or however the Bible clearly explains it. I will never go back to affiliating myself with the WTS because there is NO HOLY SPIRIT THERE.

  The other side of the coin is that the Watchtower has a lot to answer for, and the way child abuse has been handled is only a very small part of what ails the Watchtower Society. As one of Jehovah's Witnesses I fully expect and anticipate Jehovah's judgment to lay the Watchtower low.

  Yes, you have that much right, the Watchtower and anyone who defends their wicked policies and "image is more important than children" agenda WILL BE LAID LOW.

  Then each Witness will have to come to terms with the real issue, and not the phony ones presented before us by the Devil. The real issue will be whether we have faith in Jehovah God even when everything seems to be going wrong, when what we have been taught about the future appears to be all wrong.

  AGAIN, this is what I've always believed, WE are each accountable to God, regardless of which organization we are associated with. I could sign up with the UN tomorrow and use the excuse that I only need to do so to get access to their library, God will not destroy me. Further, since Satan is father of the lie and if by YOUR OWN admission "what we have taught about the future appears to be all wrong" then I choose not to support the WTS lies.

  That's when we will have to step up and provide an answer to Christ's somewhat disturbing question that he posed, saying: "When the Son of man arrives, will he really find the faith on the earth ?" I don't think the Watchtower is going to be there to offer much encouragment to the faithful to help them through, and I am sure Bill Bowen won't be anywhere to be found when Jehovah drops the hammer. / You Know

  BZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ WRONG! You are now putting yourself in the place of God. Has your claim to be "anointed" mislead you into the sin of haughtiness so that you are now "qualified" to JUDGE? Be careful with yourself! You are walking on the edge of the cliff of BLASPHEMY.

  /YoursChelbie

  Edited by - YoursChelbie on 7 August 2002 22:21:47
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  You Know

  Chelbie says:

  You ARE NOT an apostate in the sense that YOU KNOW refers to apostates

  An apostate, as I use the term, applies to any JW or XJW who imagines that Jehovah is not going to bring his people into judgment.

  IT IS YOU KNOW Who needs the mercy of God. As well as people like him who knowingly continue to support an organization that has brought shame to God's name by its actions.

  How true. And it stands to reason that only Jehovah's Witnesses can bring reproach on the holy name of Jehovah. That being the case, as the scriptures prescribe, those who are teachers and so-called leaders can expect to have a heavier judgment, even as Christ said in connection with his faithful slave at the 12 chapter of Luke. That in itself proves that Jehovah has an organization, the fact that his own judicial decree legally, scripturally, holds the leadership of the organization accountable. That being the case why should anyone leave the only organization that Jehovah specifically takes note of for the purpose of correcting and saving? The truth is that 99% of Jehovah's Witnesses are not pedophiles and have no knowledge of anyone who is. If those in a leadership capacity have sinned and knowingly shielded child molestors, for whatever misguided reason, then Christ will bring them to judgment. Although I admire Bowen's zeal and courage, standing out in front of Bethel with placards for a TV photo-op isn't going to solve the problem.

  I'm going to teach you something you don't know---without my head covered--- mr. YOU "KNOW": I have NO agenda,

  LOL That's okay little sister, you just go ahead and let me have it. This ain't the kingdom hall. Let me tell you, my wife is plenty steamed too. She has had a couple of family members abused back in the '80s which we dealt with and ran itnto all kinds of crap from the brothers. So, yeah, I get it from all sides.

  I am sick and disgusted by all the lies of the WTS which you so blindly support.

  Whoa, whoa, stop right there....How can you dare call me a "blind supporter" of the Wt? How many of Jehovah's Witnesses do you know who are willing of coming on a board like this and try and deal with the issues? I know what's going on and I have stated fairly clearly why I remain one of Jehovah's Witnesses. If anything I could call you a blind supporter of the apostate movement, but I won't because I know that you have merely been stumbled.

  I have been stumbled or however the Bible clearly explains it. I will never go back to affiliating myself with the WTS because there is no holy spirit there.

  Hmmm. And you know this for a fact? Could it not rather be the case that youy have become insensitive to the presence of the holy spirit? Wouldn't that explain why you have allowed yourself to become stumbled? I certainly see the evidence of the holy spirit on the lives of many individuals throughout the congregations.

  Yes, you have that much right, the Watchtower and anyone who defends their wicked policies and "image is more important than children" agenda WILL BE LAID LOW.

  Being laid low doesn't mean that we are destroyed. Paul wrote and said that we are '"Thrown down but not destroyed."

  AGAIN, this is what I've always believed, WE are each accountable to God, regardless of which organization we are associated with.

  Then you were never really one of Jehovah's Witnesses to begin with. That pretty much explains things to me.

  I could sign up with the UN tomorrow and use the excuse that I only need to do so to get access to their library, God will not destroy me.

  Are you sure about that? I think Jehovah is going to rip those Bozos apart who steered the Watchtower into that mess. Do you want me to go over some specific prophecies that touch on that?

  Further, since Satan is father of the lie and if by YOUR OWN admission "what we have taught about the future appears to be all wrong" then I choose not to support the WTS lies.

  That's your choice. But, be advised that you don't know some basic facts about how Jehovah operates. Namely, that "God allows an operation of error to go forth" among his people to weed out those who don't absolutely love the truth. So, apparently you have found the error that you were looking for. We wish you the best.

  / You Know
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  Crazy151drinker

  blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah I lie on this board to both myself and the other users blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah my head is in the sand blah blah blah blah blah ignorance is bliss blah blah blah blah blah blah If I pretend the abuse doesnt exist it will go away and if it doesnt I will wait on Jehovah even though he is running 27 years late blah blah blah blah blah blah blah