Dateline--Dialogue with a JW

by patio34 16 Replies latest jw friends

  • patio34
    patio34

    One of my sons is a really gung-ho JW. Here's a response i sent to my son after he sent me an e-mail about the recent publicity over Dateline. What do you think? It couldn't get me df'd could it, if he turns it over. I believe he is a total "party man."
    _______________________________________________________________
    Dear *****,

    Thanks for your e-mail and your explanation of the pedophile policy in the JWs. By the way, did you see the Dateline program, so you really can know the complete picture, including the victims' side of the story?

    In your e-mail, you said:

    -as required by law, elders must report to local authorities any
    incident(even if only one witness(i.e. victim)

    I understood this to be applicable in only 14 states and has not always been done by the elders. In other cases, the families have been strongly discouraged from going to the proper authorities in order to protect the reputation of the congregation.

    -no person who has ever committed or been convicted of committing sexual abuse against a minor would ever be allowed to hold a position of responsibility in cong.(pioneer, elder, servant, etc.)

    How does this protect children? This does not slow down the molester by such loss of privileges. In fact, this does nothing at all to stop the crime. Additionally, it's my understanding, correct me if I'm wrong, that a sealed envelope accompanies the molester's file and the elders can therefore keep their children away from him, but the congregation is not warned.

    be assured that the Jehovah's Witness' biblical policy on sex-related issues will continue to be refined so that the kids in the cong. will be protected

    Children have not been protected in the past, due to a reluctance of elders to have the congregation's name besmirched in the community. As shown on the Dateline program, a life-long JW in good standing, who admits that he has always molested children, been df'd 2-3 times, still goes door-to-door. And the congregation, unless he admits it, is ignorant of his proclivities. Then they allow their children to associate with such a family. Although, as I stated, the elders have access to this information. The "new" WT policy, as stated in the letter, does little to change this and I don't see how a child can be protected unless the molester is prosecuted by the proper authorities.

    their policy of course is based on the bible primarily and is as follows:
    -2 witnesses to establish an accusation that would lead to congregational judicial action; though they could be 2 witnesses of separate incidents.

    Since the policy is based on the Bible, it is a religious rule. Child molesting is a criminal action and should be dealt with by the proper authorities that deal with criminals. Families should not feel they will be penalized by pursuing this. Congregations also need to have a way of warning other families that there may be a child molester among them.

    JW policy differs vastly from that of the Catholic church who still are contemplating letting a priest serve if having committed no more than one incident. of course, they are deciding that still

    Actually, the JW has access to more children than the priest, it seems to me. Because of the families who closely associate and have no warning. The priest doesn't go door-to-door either, thereby giving the JW access to a wider group of people. Plus, the JW, while not serving in the congregation is hardly slowed down by such loss of privileges. In fact, this does nothing at all to stop the crime.

    the witnesses have biblical and lawful view on the matter and whatever "scandal" there has been is isolated and is condoned in no way.

    Again, since it is a religious law, it should not intervene in criminal cases. Additionally, in the case in Othello, Washington, the molester was supported by dozens in the congregation who were present for both of his trials, thus it was tacitly condoned. The victim was shunned, even though she was not, and still is not, disfellowshipped. The child molester, Manuel Beliz who was an elder, was convicted twice & is now imprisoned for 11½ yrs. He rec'd congregation support at the 2nd trial, even after his 1st conviction. He was permitted to go in field service between his two trials.

    Certainly at least some congregations have handled it wrongly in the past. A Circuit Overseer relayed the message that all the elders associated with the reinstatement of Manuel Beliz, the convicted JW child molester, have been deleted as elders. This was one of the primary persons on the Dateline program.
    ___________________________________________________
    There seems to be mixed feelings on the recent letter read in all the congregations about the situation. I heard that it has angered many abuse survivors in the organization. They express it is a whitewash of old policy, once again leaving the victims in harm's way. A sister in California commented, "How dare they arrogantly ignore the protection of children and pat themselves on the back for doing nothing." One brother in Florida finished his student talk and stated, "I will never set foot in a Kingdom Hall again till the Governing Body changes their policy to protect children." He then walked out. In another congregation in Tennessee, as the letter was being read an elder of over 40 years took his Kingdom Hall keys off the ring and walked back to give them to the PO. After the meeting when asked why, the elder stated, "I can no longer serve or support the policy on molestation stated in that letter." Several individuals have expressed the desire to pursue the injustice committed against them by the way the home office handled their abuse by going to the courts and filing legal action as a result blatant disregard for victims offered in the letter read to all Jehovah's Witnesses in the USA.

    I believe you're an eminently fair person and care very deeply about issues. The only way to be fair is to hear all the sides of the issue. So, FYI: the Dateline program will re-air this weekend on MSNBC. MSNBC is a news program along the format of CNN, Dateline has a contract through NBC and when they have an exceptional program MSNBC runs it again. The program will is called "Dateline Weekend Edition" which airs 2-3 times over the weekend. You'll need to check your local listing for the time in your area. That is this weekend June 8-9 and there should be more than one airing.

    It's nice to have a frank discussion ...

    Love,
    Mom
    ___________________________________________________________

    I haven't heard back from him and if and when I do, it's probably going to just drop as it's stressful to have this "discussion," when i know that it's angering both of us. Plus, i don't want to completely alienate him.

    Just wanted some opinions!

    Pat

  • ashitaka
    ashitaka

    Tough one, pat. I had to eventually face the harder issues with my father, and nothing but good came of it. Maybe you should just drop it after this, but it was a good letter. I think you were fair enough, but you sounded just as though you had a problem with this situation only, not the WTBTS as a whole(that's good, since you want to reach him somehow). I think he'll just chalk it off as emotion, but hear your words nonetheless. I liked the letter.

    He may take it the wrong way, but I think that if even he's a diehard JW, he'll just let things lie. That is, unless you think he wants to turn you in..????

    ashi

  • teenyuck
    teenyuck

    Patio, if he turns you in, do what Bowen and others have done...hire an attorney. Do not go to any JC alone.

    No matter what, you do not have to justify your words or actions to them....you have rights and if they try to besmirch your reputation by hauling you in, fight it.

    I told my mother this today. She has been quite vocal on how wrong the society is and she hopes they get what they deserve. I told her that her words could get her in trouble.

    I advised her to not meet or speak with any elders on this. She laughed nervously and I think it sank in that she has been quite vociferous on the Dateline episode.

    Please, please do not let them take advantage of you.
    Hugs,
    Tina

  • plmkrzy
    plmkrzy

    The letter I think is very good. Extreemely reasonable. If he were to discuss this with the elders in his cong. maybe he would just highlight some concerns and not share the entire letter. It would be rather tacky to show your letter around with out your consent. But then....blah blah blah.

    Even if they did read your letter there is nothing in it that would be grounds for being df'd. Your not bashing. Just expressing some concerns with your son and it is private.

    .........................It's the silence between the notes, that make the music.....................
  • patio34
    patio34

    Thanks for the replies.

    Ashi, Sorry it didn't work out that well with your dad. Ironically, this one son and I have never gotten along that well, even when I was a JW. Your name would be appropriate today where I am as there's a big brush fire in the area and we have ashes everywhere!

    PlmKrzy, Thanks for reading it. I tried to make it as reasonable and as factual as I could. I copied some of the reports at the end from a letter by Bill Bowen.

    I really wouldn't care that much about the df'g, except i have 2 grandsons that wouldn't be allowed to see me probably.

    Puffsrule, it wouldn't seem that my statements would be that incriminating. But you're right, I would get an attorney really quickly. I have a copy of AlanF's letter too about "don't bother me and I won't bother you" (the congregation, that is).

    But, you know, it's just hard to sit and listen to the pompous self-righteousness of some JWs and, sorry to say, my son falls in that category. The other nite he kept me on the phone for an hour and a half, dropping phrases about "the truth" and "encouraging" me ever so subtly. I know the drill, as i used to attempt it. But not with someone who wanted nothing to do with it!

    I decided the next day to limit our conversations to 5-10 minutes and not let it wander into irritating areas.

  • Realist
    Realist

    is it true that the dateline show will re-air this weekend on msnbc?

  • detective
    detective

    Could you ask your son why only jw children deserve to be protected from a sexual predator? If they know they've got a molester on their hands and they kick him out without notifying the police, where does he go for victims? Why do only JW children matter? UGH! That is really infuriating!

    Good luck with this, Pat. It must be hard hearing this kind of stuff.

  • patio34
    patio34

    Realist, that notice about Dateline re-showing this weekend was posted by Bill Bowen on another site yesterday. Probably his website has the info too.

    Detective, What a good idea! That is so true and it hadn't occurred to me. As usual, JWs don't give a hoot about anyone else in the community! What an incredibly hypocritical bunch of idiots!!

    Thanks!

  • Grunt
    Grunt

    Hi Patio,
    You are in grave danger of losing your son. I wrote a letter far less blunt and open than yours and got a business letter in reply saying my daughter had decided to shun me. She had been "sharing" my letters with her elders and they said it was a conscience call but that I seemed to be trying to destroy her faith. She had brought up the discussion with me and said how glad she was that we could be "Honest" with one another, ha, I wonder if the elders had prompted her to say that? Had I known I would have addressed my letter differently and used the plural when talking to her. Anyway, don't underestimate how irrational a Jehovah's Witness can be. My big faith destroyer was asking her what the current Witness view on naming the animals and the 7000 year creative days is. Three years now it has been this summer. It was good timing for her though, a different relative had given them a car so she could return the keys to one she had been borrowing for a year with the note saying she was shunning me. Not face to face mind you, under the door when she knew we were out of state. Ah Jehovah's Witnesses, sterling people. Bold and fearless with not at homes. Sick bastards. They took a nice, loving little girl and twisted her heart with a smug promise of eternal life. The cruel irony of what she got for what she gave up would be funny if it weren't so sad. Had to give up Christ as mediator, had to accept being a second class Christian if a Christian at all, had to give up friends, family, a career and kids. All to peddle lies for a cult. Reading WatchTowers must kill braincells, she used to be smarter than that.

  • patio34
    patio34

    Dear Grunt,

    Thanks for your reply. I'm sorry that things worked out so badly with your daughter.

    It feels that you are right about losing my relationship with my son with that letter, but on the other hand, I was honest and extremely tactful compared with my true feelings. If he chooses to shun me for that, then that's his business.

    It sounds as if I'm a bit hard-hearted maybe, but I'm through being bullied and pushed around by JWs. Fortunately for me the rest of my family has left the org and he's the only one staying in. This son and I have always had a strained relationship and i'm not inclined to let him be so agressive with "the truth" with me.

    But I realize that your relationship with your daughter is probably very different. I may change my tune later on, but we just gotta do what seems right.

    Best regards,
    Pat

Share this

Google+
Pinterest
Reddit