MEMORIAL SPEAKER LIES ABOUT THE BIBLE!

by The Searcher 9 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • The Searcher
    The Searcher

    Surprise, Surprise!!

    He said that the 144,000 would sit on thrones as kings and priests, and that they would judge people! I'm missing something; I don't remember reading any verses which say any of these things.

    Let me see..............Rev. 14:1 says they're identified as being part of God and Christ's "family"; v 2,3 says they sing a new song and play harps; v 4,5 says they are 'virgins' who follow the Lamb wherever he goes (they don't share kingship with him) and they are not liars!

    Nope, I didn't see any thrones, kings, priests or judges mentioned there!!!

    Maybe the Apostle John simply got things wrong as he was writing them down - the same way that Luke was mistaken in chapter 22 when he recorded that Judas was present when Christ handed out the bread & wine for the New Covenant! (it-2 p. 130Judas - Luke’s presentation of this incident evidently is not in strict chronological order, for Judas had definitely left by the time Christ commended the group for having stuck with him)

  • sir82
    sir82

    They conflate the "24 elders" of Revelation 5 with the "144,000" of Revelation 14. Revelation 5 does speak of "kings & priests", so that is their Biblical basis, such as it is.

    Does any other group or scholar equate the "24 elders" with the "144,000"?

  • sarahsmile
    sarahsmile

    He is just wrong! JW take Rev 20:4 "thrones" and claim these are the 144,000! No proof what so ever! Wt claims they follow Jesus Rev 19:4 to the battle dressed in white robes.

    No one knows who was given the right to judge." They refused to worship the beast or idol,they refused to let its mark be put on their foreheads." Revelation 19 the multitude could be part of the ones judging after the wedding supper! They were given white robes.

    Also the apostles were given rights to judge, but JWs will say that is a lot of people to judge so it is 144,000 whi h incljdes the 12.

    JWs say that the New Testament bible 144,000 started during Christ time with the apostles. All of Pauls congregations are small portion of the 144,000! All the way to the end of times! Jehovahs Witnesses. So why would JWs need to make notes how many 144,000 remained? Wt would need to know the portion of 144,000 in New Testament, Pauls congregation. That is how you know it is false and made up because WT keep track of a number but the did not subtract New Testament 144,000. 144,000 -New Testament= JW remaining 144,000. They would not know!

    Christendom claims it is the Church,Catholics, only as a member.

    Protestant they are the Church! only member!

    There is no way of figuring out who gets to sit on the thrones and judge with Jesus! I will stick with the apostles only!

    What does the right to judge have anything to do with partaking! Only Jah can pick who is going to sit with Jesus to judge!

    Your right it just made up lies from interpretation of WT.

    I think the family of Christ sounds better! But I doubt they are given judgement seats. No one knows!

  • blondie
    blondie

    (Revelation 5:1-10) 5

    And I saw in the right hand of the One seated upon the throne a scroll written within and on the reverse side, sealed tight with seven seals. 2 And I saw a strong angel proclaiming with a loud voice: “Who is worthy to open the scroll and loose its seals?” 3 But neither in heaven nor upon earth nor underneath the earth was there a single one able to open the scroll or to look into it. 4 And I gave way to a great deal of weeping because no one was found worthy to open the scroll or to look into it. 5 But one of the elders says to me: “Stop weeping. Look! The Lion that is of the tribe of Judah, the root of David, has conquered so as to open the scroll and its seven seals.” 6 And I saw standing in the midst of the throne and of the four living creatures and in the midst of the elders a lamb as though it had been slaughtered, having seven horns and seven eyes, which [eyes] mean the seven spirits of God that have been sent forth into the whole earth. 7 And he went and at once took [it] out of the right hand of the One seated on the throne. 8 And when he took the scroll, the four living creatures and the twenty-four elders fell down before the Lamb, having each one a harp and golden bowls that were full of incense, and the [incense] means the prayers of the holy ones. 9 And they sing a new song, saying: “You are worthy to take the scroll and open its seals, because you were slaughtered and with your blood you bought persons for God out of every tribe and tongue and people and nation, 10 and you made them to be a kingdom and priests to our God, and they are to rule as kings over the earth.”

    REFERENCE SCRIPTURES IN THE NWT

    (Revelation 1:4-6)

    4 John to the seven congregations that are in the [district of] Asia: May YOU have undeserved kindness and peace from “The One who is and who was and who is coming,” and from the seven spirits that are before his throne, 5 and from Jesus Christ, “the Faithful Witness,” “The firstborn from the dead,” and “The Ruler of the kings of the earth.” To him that loves us and that loosed us from our sins by means of his own blood— 6 and he made us to be a kingdom, priests to his God and Father—yes, to him be the glory and the might forever. Amen.

    (1 Peter 2:8, 9)

    . . .. 9 But YOU are “a chosen race, a royal priesthood, a holy nation, a people for special possession, that YOU should declare abroad the excellencies” of the one that called YOU out of darkness into his wonderful light.

    (Matthew 19:27, 28)

    27 Then Peter said to him in reply: “Look! We have left all things and followed you; what actually will there be for us?” 28 Jesus said to them: “Truly I say to YOU, In the re-creation, when the Son of man sits down upon his glorious throne, YOU who have followed me will also yourselves sit upon twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel.

    (Revelation 20:4)

    4 And I saw thrones, and there were those who sat down on them, and power of judging was given them. Yes, I saw the souls of those executed with the ax for the witness they bore to Jesus and for speaking about God, and those who had worshiped neither the wild beast nor its image and who had not received the mark upon their forehead and upon their hand. And they came to life and ruled as kings with the Christ for a thousand years.

    (Revelation 22:3-5)

    3 And no more will there be any curse. But the throne of God and of the Lamb will be in [the city], and his slaves will render him sacred service; 4 and they will see his face, and his name will be on their foreheads. 5 Also, night will be no more, and they have no need of lamplight nor [do they have] sunlight, because Jehovah God will shed light upon them, and they will rule as kings forever and ever.

    Just reporting, not supporting; the WTS likes to string scriptures together

    Other ideas about the 24 elders

    http://m.biblestudytools.com/commentaries/revelation/revelation-4/revelation-4-4.html

  • RubaDub
    RubaDub

    What do you expect all of those people sitting on the thrones to do ? ... hold hands and sing Kumbaya ?

    Rub a Dub

  • designs
    designs

    How many verses are there to Kumbaya anyway????

  • Crazyguy
    Crazyguy

    Rev 5:9 discribed the great crowd and not the 144K read 5:9-10 then 7:9 oops is the great crowd and not the 144K.

  • designs
    designs

    If Jesus and Paul could patch quilt OT verses and make up a new religion why can't the JWs....

  • Roberta804
    Roberta804

    It is that new gray bible they made.

  • sarahsmile
    sarahsmile

    I sometimes think that Revelation 19 goes with 20. The opposite of The Wt teachings! :-)

    After these things I heard [ a ] a loud voice of a great multitude in heaven, saying, “Alleluia! Salvation and glory and honor and power belong to the Lord [ b ] our God! 2 For true and righteous are His judgments, because He has judged the great harlot who corrupted the earth with her fornication; and He has avenged on her the blood of His servants shed by her.” 3 Again they said, “Alleluia! Her smoke rises up forever and ever!” 4 And the twenty-four elders and the four living creatures fell down and worshiped God who sat on the throne, saying, “Amen! Alleluia!” 5 Then a voice came from the throne, saying, “Praise our God, all you His servants and those who fear Him, both [ c ] small and great!”

    6 And I heard, as it were, the voice of a great multitude, as the sound of many waters and as the sound of mighty thunderings, saying, “Alleluia! For the [ d ] Lord God Omnipotent reigns! 7 Let us be glad and rejoice and give Him glory, for the marriage of the Lamb has come, and His wife has made herself ready.” 8 And to her it was granted to be arrayed in fine linen, clean and bright, for the fine linen is the righteous acts of the saints.

    9 Then he said to me, “Write: ‘Blessed are those who are called to the marriage supper of the Lamb!’” And he said to me, “These are the true sayings of God.” 10 And I fell at his feet to worship him. But he said to me, “See that you do notdo that! I am your fellow servant, and of your brethren who have the testimony of Jesus. Worship God! For the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy.”

    Revelation 20:4)

    4 And I saw thrones, and there were those who sat down on them, and power of judging was given them. Yes, I saw the souls of those executed with the ax for the witness they bore to Jesus and for speaking about God, and those who had worshiped neither the wild beast nor its image and who had not received the mark upon their forehead and upon their hand. And they came to life and ruled as kings with the Christ for a thousand years.

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