Paradise is going to suck!

by WasOnceBlind 41 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • BU2B

    Paradise would be a restrictive tyranny by default. Even under a "human" tyranny you at least can have your own thoughts between your ears. In the JW new world, you will be punished for even your private thoughts!

    I think what enabled me to wake up when I did was the fact that I had decided that I would NOT want to live in this world even if it were true. I didnt like the Idea of bethel and the "paradise" just seemed like a worldwide bethel. The elimination of the fear of dying at armageddon or "missing out" on paradise enabled me to do real research and open minded, rational thinking without emotions or fear getting in the way. I just didnt want their carrot they were dangling anymore! I was like the donkey with the carrot dangling in front of him, only I hate carrots!

  • redvip2000

    Hmm, let's think on this.....If a tiger no longer needed to hunt and chase prey, it would no longer need it's razor sharp claws, muscular and agile body, or amazing senses.

    Reminds me of the first time i questioned Watchtower doctrine. During my bible study as a teenager. I remember asking why Jehoober made animals totally adapted to hunting and eating flesh, being that they were supposed to eat grass.

    I still remember my instructor looking puzzled and then simply saying in a somewhat annoyed tone :"What's with all the questions? Sometimes you just need to have faith". As a kid, i felt bad for asking that and i simply ignored the obvious trouble with that teaching.

  • redvip2000

    Not only would it be boring, it would straight out be miserable. I mean think about it, with technology gone it would be a cycle of never ending manual labor. Building, farming, harvesting, making clothing from scratch, days to travel a couple hundred miles, etc.

    Yes, basically like being amish now. Actually worse than being amish, because at least they have the option to leave. I've said this before - Paradise is now. yes i would love to live forever, but here in this type of world where i can actually have fun, and do so many great things that are available.

  • BU2B

    It breaks my heart to hear JWs put off travelling, marriage, kids, career etc and say they can do it all in "the new world". It is so sad that they mortgage the present for a future as real as the easter bunny!

    Even something as simple as weekends are wasted. Most who work 5 days a week spend the weekends in fulfilling, fun persuits, yet the JW rationalizes that they will have all the time in the world, eternity to do whatever they want, thus they waste their free time for the cult because they are the "more important things". Time is the most valuable commodity humans have. What billionare would not trade their money for a longer life! The JWs waste time and potential for a lie. A true tragedy.

  • TD

    Do you happen to know of other similar roadblocks

    Cellulose is a huge roadblock. Vegetation consumed as food is loosely classified by its "quality" which is a term that denotes both the food value and the ease of digestion. High quality vegetation would be roots, tubers, fruit, tender leaves and shoots; Low quality vegetation would be stalks, stems and tougher leaves. Cellulose is the structural material that reinforces plant tissue, so the lower the quality the higher the cellulose content will be.

    Cellulose is digested in a two stage process requiring mechanical breakdown with special grinding teeth and chemical breakdown via symbiotic bacteria in special chambers. Animals that have neither (i.e. All carnivores) are not able to live on low quality vegetation. Period.

    The lowest quality vegetation imaginable is the biologically inactive, dried out stalks of grass plants. (i.e. Straw) There's a big, big difference between hay and straw. Horses and cattle will eat straw now and then but even with their special teeth and digestive organs, they can't live on it exclusively.

    On this subject, one of the favorite JW anecdotes involves big cats being fed a vegetarian diet in British zoos during WWII. This overlooks the human element. What these cats were fed was a diet mixed, ground and fortified by humans and there are no wild forms of vegetation that even remotely approximate it.

    Another problem with the JW belief in an all vegetarian ecology is scavengers. They play an important role in the decomposition chain and they're so obviously beneficial that JW writers sometimes forget themselves and call them, "Jehovah's natural sanitation squad" which is an implicit acknowledgment that all animals were not "created" as vegetarians.

    Another problem is the fact that herbivorous animals are predators themselves inasmuch as plant populations are subject to intense predation from grazers. (i.e.There is a direct relationship between grazing intensity and tree replacement in forests.)

    The biggest single roadblock IMHO is that the JW belief in an all vegetarian ecology is a repudiation of the creation argument. (Unfortunately, you won't get much mileage out of it because JW's don't really understand why they believe what they believe...)

    Anti-reductionism is the heart of all creation arguments including the JW flavor of creationism. Complex things like flight, they say, could not possibly have evolved because of the sheer number of simultaneous change to various parts of the body that would be required.

    Well, the same argument applies to predation. Note how the French naturalist Georges Cuvier described it:

    "That the claws may seize the prey, they must have a certain mobility in the talons, a certain strength in the nails, whence will result determinate formations in all the claws, and the necessary distribution of muscles and tendons; it will be necessary that the fore arm have a certain facility of turning, whence again will result determinate formation in the bones which compose it; but the bone of the forearm, articulating in the shoulder-bone, cannot change its structure, without this latter also changes. The shoulder-blade will have a certain degree of strength in those animals, which employ their legs to seize with, and they will thence obtain peculiar structure. The play of all these parts will require certain properties in all the muscles and the impression of these muscles so proportioned, will more fully determine the structure of the bones."

    The JW's can't have it both ways. They can't claim that evolution is impossible using Cuvier's same basic argument while simultaneously claiming that predators exist today because, "..existing features were put to a different use.." than what God originally intended.

  • FayeDunaway
    Vidiot...witness 'paradise' sounds like North Korea. Imagine, North Korea, all over the world!!!
  • InjusticeSystem

    TD - Thank you for your insightful reply, I appreciate the information very much. This has been one of my longest standing questions/thought experiments, and one of the first to cause me to question the promises made in the Bible and by JW's. I can only hope that some of my JW family members will find this information..."digestible."

    Sorry, couldn't help myself.

  • brandnew

    Ummmm the HARLEY is gone, and the BARBEQUE is gone, .....

    Just kill me when i get there........

  • Deltawave
    So many JWs choose to be miserable now and neglect themselves beleiving they will do it all in paradise. Really makes me sad. They also expect to be miserable because these are the last days after all??!!
  • Vidiot

    Driving Force - "The JW's can't have it both ways. They can't claim that evolution is impossible using Cuvier's same basic argument while simultaneously claiming that predators exist today because, '..existing features were put to a different use..' than what God originally intended.."

    The Watchtower Society...

    ...having their cake and eating it too since 1884.

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