Big Bang........ Big silence....

by snare&racket 16 Replies latest jw friends

• 

  snare&racket

  I am 32, old enough to remember being told to refute the Big Bang as untrue by my parents and the religion they brought me up in.

  it was a big decision for me even as a teen, I knew I was choosing a side, I remember my physics teacher laughing and mocking me and the other JW for denying the Big Bang. Our parents arranged that in our exams we were allowed to answer questions on the big bang in a unique manner:

  "scientists claim......... but as a JW I do not subscribe to this belief."

  I remember countless Sunday talks mocking the idea of a Big Bang, of course they were laced in ignorance of the theory, with no effort to look at the evidence, but it was said without hesitation. Genesis and the bible clearly describes the formation of the universe, yet the Big Bang explanation gave another, very different explanation, not divine at all. When mapped on computers about ten years ago, the Big Bang model mapped the universe as we find it.

  For years now in Europe, at the large hadron collider they replicate the first millionth of a second of the Big Bang, the boundary of sciences knowledge has come that far in the years since my youth. Yet still no budge from the JWs, yet there was evidence for the Big Bang even back then......

  and now..... now they have mapped the radiation of the Big Bang confirming once and for all that I was indeed on the wrong side of the fence, I was taught untruth and lied to.

  The Big Bang has been proven true and the silence speaks volumes.......

  Planck telescope maps light of the big bang scattered across the universe

  Most detailed ever chart of cosmic microwave background confirms remarkable accuracy of current cosmological models

  

  http://www.guardian.co.uk/science/2013/mar/21/planck-telescope-light-big-bang-universe

  No doubt this evidence will be ignored as angry atheist rhetoric or some odd intepretation of the bible will be presented. Either way, the Big Bang model is a done deal.

  This was a huge and significant news story for me, I dont think I could ignore it if I still clung on to the words in those ancient scrolls, proven untrue AGAIN. I would have to contend with huge questions..."How could the creator NOT know how the universe was formed? "Or is the bible that flawed?

  Every huge piece of evidence confirming my decisions regarding the side of the fence I now stand, not only brings great reassurance but frustration too. It is clear that evidence was clearly not part of the decisions my parents made in what they taught me or what the elders spouted in those Sunday talks. Evidence is irrelevant to the people that will go down with the ship,their children in tow, adamant to stand by beliefs that they have chosen.

  Where are the Christians saying ....."Wow!" or "We were wrong" or "I need to explore my beliefs and reassess!".....???

  Its too much to expect "Sorry" I know.

  Many believers think atheists come across as angry and frustrated. After you have finished making the bible fit the scientific Big Bang model, maybe take a few minutes out to consider all of this again.

  Maybe take a trip to the museum and check out some of the other evidence for things science claims to be true.... Maybe it isn't all a conspiracy against your beliefs

  snare
• 

  still thinking

  Honestly snare. It baffles me how I managed to switch my brain off as I did. I'd ask 'what was I thinking" but the truth is...I wasn't.
• 

  irondork

  You know, I never had a problem with the big bang theory in school AND the Genesis account of creation. The bible says God created the heavens and earth. Period. No details on how. Science theorizes the physical universe came into existence in one massive explosion.

  I don't see a contradiction.

  All I see is paranoia on the part of Religion, Inc. toward anything scientific.
• 

  LouBelle

  The more I read geological / scientific books - the more I realise that the big bang theory isn't that odd to believe.
• 

  prologos

  Iron dork. right on. look at the plank picture:

  scanning in all directions, it is almost the same. we are at the center of the universe, as we always thought.

  and we are right, and so is every body else that cares to look from anywhere in the universe. so: science trumps the bible except

  when you get into the devilish details of talking snakes & asses with 5D* vision and the four corners of the (obviously) flat earth etc.

  So: stick with science and dont the let the details of the good book bother you brother.

  *looking past the 3 space and I time dimension to see the angel from eden now (Then) doing duty in Palestine.
• 

  Phizzy

  I don't remember anything in print from the WT that actually denied the Big Bang, I never heard a Bro cast doubt on it either ?????????

  Is this just the U.K ?
• 

  snare&racket

  Prologos that is simply not true,

  " First, it’s important to know that the big bang wasn’t an explosion of matter into empty space—it was the rapid expansion of space itself. This means that every single point in the universe appears to be at the center. "

  http://www.popsci.com/technology/article/2012-04/fyi-where-center-universe

  The earth is not centre of our universe! Again something believed due to the bible and older beliefs, but long ago evidence (17th century heliocentric model) made known it to be evidently untrue. The earth is NOT at the centre of the universe, that is impossible...there is no centre, no edges to the universe. This is my exact point reiterated!

  Your observation of the image is a bit wrong buddy, the reason the image is a circle is simple, the limits of any detector in all directions will form a circular data reading, and the observer taking the reading will always be in the centre. Just like a radar reading, it provides a circular sweep with the observer in the centre. It doesn't mean the observer is the centre of anything..... and neither is the earth.

  

  Ironwork, that is not true either,

  I figured people would pretend that Genesis 1 did not exist. Intepret the modern English translation of scrolls from 2000 years ago however you want, but Jews believed that the earth was a flat circlular disc (hence "circle" of the earth) that lay on top of columns (hence earthquakes are referenced as god shaking these colums), they also believed in a 'firmament'.... A fixed surrounding to the earth in which all the stars and the sun & moon were fixed, rotating around the earth. Now they just translate the words to suit the knowledge of our times.either way, its still wrong.

  The Big Bang disproves all of the following......

  "14 Then God said, "Let there be lights in the firmament of the heavens to divide the day from the night; and let them be for signs and seasons, and for days and years; 15 and let them be for lights in the firmament of the heavens to give light on the earth"; and it was so. 16 Then God made two great lights: the greater light to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night. He made the stars also. 17 God set them in the firmament of the heavens to give light on the earth, 18 and to rule over the day and over the night, and to divide the light from the darkness. And God saw that it was good. 19 So the evening and the morning were the fourth day."

  Maybe you should read up on the Big Bang.... 'brief history of time' by Hawkins is good. I didn't understand how you could say that there is no conflict, but then it dawned on me that you likely don't realise what we have proven with the model. This does not make you stupid, until the day I read up on baseball rules I am ignorant of baseball rules. That's all, no offence intended.

  Phizzy, I had an anti-big bang discussion with a JW just a few months ago.

  The society have shared their thoughts on the Big Bang also...

  " If the cosmos and everything in it are the product of spontaneous combinations of elements after the primordial big bang , then there can be no real purpose to life." g 12/09 Purposeful Design or Mindless Process?
• 

  Captain Blithering

  well.

  This is new to me, I always thought the big bang was accepted as fact even among JW's, I've mentioned it a few times to various folk and had no real comments about it.

  My own personal thinking (increasingly untrustworthy I find) was always that the big bang HAPPENED, the universe had a BEGINNING, (science agreeing with the bibles description that there was nothing, then there was something), but obviously Jehovah started it off, far from being the spontaneous random event as portrayed by scientists..

  That was always my thinking anyway, and I've not been corrected/chastised by anyone yet, but I suppose one reason why JW's may recoil at the mention of the BB might be 'cos of the unmistakable link to the words accident/spontaneous/evolution etc.

  I never read the Awake quoted above. But then I've read very little of the literature for a long time.
• 

  QC

  @snare

  JWs are no longer relevant; they are not “the true religion.” More and more folks know this. So, what they think, or use to think, about science is a museum relic. Done. Over. Dusty.

  And, Jews did not believe the earth was a flat circular disc in space. The only way the earth can appear as a circle from any point in space (God is ubiquitous) it would have to be a sphere.

  Your trying to be clever creating straw man arguments isn’t working.

  Many ex-JWs left the BORG because the “GB FDS” refuse to be "faithful" to Biblical as well as scientific truth. This brand of Christian won't go with you either down slippery slope silly reasoning.

  We believe in the Big Bang.
• 

  prologos

  S&N, in an expanding universe of space and its content, starting from a point of origin, every most distant point is equi distant from itself. A distant observer looking in our direction with her own PLANK sensors would see us as part of the back ground radiation. Every point in the universe was once a part of the Big bang.

  We are the center of the universe, and so is EVERYBODY ELSE. and look to them to be the fringe.