High gas prices / Extremist Muslim regimes / China playing everyone for fools?

tootired2care

This is probably a dull topic for some, but I did some research out of my own curiosity, and just wanted to put it here for my own future reference, but I'm also curious to hear your thoughts on this as well.

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Muslim extremism is still a big problem, and a major threat to world energy markets. Examples Iran, muslim brotherhood in charge of Egypt etc. As usual the NATO/western powers are going to have to deal with this problem again real soon.

It's so interesting that while all this unfolds the Chinese with their great military power, just sits back and does absolutely nothing and reaps all the benefits of stability in the middle east afforded by U.S./U.K. Did you know that most oil now pumped out of the middle east does not go to the United States by even a long shot?

Yes that's right the next time you go to full up at the pump, and you want a place to direct your anger, here is some interesting information below for you. Each year China/India and other parts of Asia are gobbling up a larger and larger percentage of the OPEC oil.

Interestingly most of these nations havn't done anything to help increase stability in that region, or payed a tribute for what they've been afforded by the blood and treasure of those nations that have (U.S., U.K. Australia ), So in essense we get to pay high prices at the pump to subsidize China's demand, isn't that wonderful? All the while China continues to build up their massive military even more.

I believe It's certainly time for nations like China to pony up and pay their fair share. What is China's game?

http://www.opec.org/opec_web/static_files_project/media/downloads/publications/ASB2012.pdf (Page 57)

http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/03/02/column-china-middle-east-oil-idUSL5E8E229T20120302

http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/7fb3ac06-a32f-11e1-8f34-00144feabdc0.html#axzz24n7yLHgZ

talesin

tt2c

It's interesting that you created this topic. I was going to type a reply to your comment re this on the other thread. :)

The bulk of energy (close to 70%) is used by manufacturing concerns. That's why 'turn off your lights to save energy' is a big joke. It's a way to make the individuals (us) feel responsible for wasting energy.

The reason China is using so much oil? The western corporations are having cheap goods manufactured in China. "We" are not allowing China's demand, "we" are creating and fostering it. China is not 'getting away' with anything - it is doing business as usual with the companies from which we purchase goods.

tal :)

Edit: follow the money!

tootired2care

I was going to type a reply to your comment re this on the other thread. :)

Glad I got this out there, before we went off topic in the other thread

China is not 'getting away' with anything - it is doing business as usual with the companies from which we purchase goods.

I have to respectfully disagree. Although many U.S. corporations like Apple do a lot of manufacturing in China, there are many other countries that have the same setup with China too. I think what the private sector does with China, is not really relevant to China as a country doing their fair share to protect their interests from which they are generating great wealth in their country with (international manufacturing etc.).

China has enriched herself with this model, and has been building up a massive military, and not lifting a finger to help on the world scene. I believe they are getting away with a lot. It concerns me that they are not using their military in a way that shows that they care about helping on the world scene as the U.S. has. Certainly doing this would ease tensions, and alleviate doubt over what their long term intentions are with such a mighty military.

King Solomon

tt2c said:

They are getting away with a lot and I'm not okay with that are you?

So what is the U.S. supposed to do? Order China to send their Navy into the Middle East, to patrol the Straight of Hormuz?

Wait a minute: who ordered the U.S. to invade Iraq again?

talesin

Well, I had decided not to post on the other thread. :)

Since we disagree on the basic premise (I see the oil as 'manufacturing', you see it as 'weaponry'), I guess I would have to say that, in general, I'm not happy with the way the world is run.

t

tootired2care

So what is the U.S. supposed to do? Order China to send their Navy into the Middle East, to patrol the Straight of Hormuz?

I agree there is not much they can do there, but what the US should do for starters is demand cheaper oil prices from OPEC than China is paying, and stop offering protection for tankers bound for Asia.

Wait a minute: who ordered the U.S. to invade Iraq again?

The reasons for that war are pretty baseless, but in the long run I believe having western influence there will prove very strategic as this messy business of dealing with these extremist muslim regimes.

tootired2care

Since we disagree on the basic premise (I see the oil as 'manufacturing', you see it as 'weaponry').

I believe it's both, but however China uses the oil it imports internally is not my concern. Just that they don't make us pay for their oil security, when they have a big enough military to handle their own interests.

I guess I would have to say that, in general, I'm not happy with the way the world is run.

No argument here, it would be interesting to fast forward centuries in advance and see what it was that finally united mankind. I feel it will have to be a problem that is outside of the earth, something to do with space travel, planet colonization etc.

Berengaria

and reaps all the benefits of stability in the middle east afforded by U.S./U.K.
Is this sarcasm?? How the hell did we promote stability???

tootired2care

Haha..nope not satire this time .

Imagine an alternate branch in time. If the U.S. had allowed Kuwait to be occupied by Iraq. Let that fester for a while and Saddam would have attacked Saudi Arabia which would have happened given Saddams hatred for them. So Saddam and Ahmadinejad controlling the whole middle east oil market, not to mention a probable war between them, that doesn't sound too stable to me. So Yes the U.S. and U.K. have brought a good measure of stability to that region that is still largly living 1000 years behind the times in their religious thinking.

So back to the point, is it right that China gets to pay the same prices for oil from that region given they've done nothing to help?

yknot

Maybe we could charge china a fee....wipeout our debt with them.

~just a random thought

High gas prices / Extremist Muslim regimes / China playing everyone for fools?

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