For Lurkers and Newbies, "How Are Kingdom Hall Elders Appointed By The Holy Spirit?"

by Bubblegum Apotheosis 13 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • Bubblegum Apotheosis
    Bubblegum Apotheosis

    As previously requested by a fellow JWN, I will post a topic about "JW Stuff", so "newbies, lurkers and recently Bittered Souls" are able to discern how the Watchtower Society's statement about "Elders being appointed by Holy Spirit" is not true.

    According to the Holy Bible, these are the requirements for being appointed an elder by men, men who are suppose to observe if their hand picked elder is obeying God's Word.

    1 Timothy 3 "Living Bible Translation"

    "3 This is a trustworthy saying: "If someone aspires to be an elder,[a] he desires an honorable position." 2 So an elder must be a man whose life is above reproach. He must be faithful to his wife.[b] He must exercise self-control, live wisely, and have a good reputation. He must enjoy having guests in his home, and he must be able to teach. 3 He must not be a heavy drinker[c] or be violent. He must be gentle, not quarrelsome, and not love money. 4 He must manage his own family well, having children who respect and obey him. 5 For if a man cannot manage his own household, how can he take care of God's church?

    6 An elder must not be a new believer, because he might become proud, and the devil would cause him to fall.[d] 7 Also, people outside the church must speak well of him so that he will not be disgraced and fall into the devil's trap.

    8 In the same way, deacons must be well respected and have integrity. They must not be heavy drinkers or dishonest with money. 9 They must be committed to the mystery of the faith now revealed and must live with a clear conscience. 10 Before they are appointed as deacons, let them be closely examined. If they pass the test, then let them serve as deacons.

    11 In the same way, their wives[e] must be respected and must not slander others. They must exercise self-control and be faithful in everything they do.

    12 A deacon must be faithful to his wife, and he must manage his children and household well. 13 Those who do well as deacons will be rewarded with respect from others and will have increased confidence in their faith in Christ Jesus."

    How many of your local elders fullfilled these requirements? Was it "Silent Bob, the elder who never speaks to anyone, just stands in his corner?"

    How about "Horny Harry who has had multipule complaints lodged against him, for his inability to control his hormones, or his uncanny knack of proposing "sex" to angry young sisters or neglected older ones."?

    Elder "Mr. Magu, he is the brother in his 80s who bumps into your car, puts love dings on your new "Land Rover's" door, he open's his door and "ding!" another dent into a friends car. Elder Magu is basically a fixture, most of his responsibilities have been stripped from him. "Elder" is the last vestige of his dignity and if he is quite, even at the cost of his conscience, he gets to keep his title!"

    "Pathological Liar Larry", Elder Larry plants "stumbling blocks" in front of his own friends, Elder Larry gets bored and want's to see some action! Sister Schizo runs up to you after meeting, "I heard you are mad at me! You said my clothes stink and I don't take showers" Lying Elder Larry, did not have the balls to address Sister Schizo, so he inserted your name (Instead of his or "the Elders are concerned about your dress") as complaining about her lack hygiene. "Elder Larry" loves trouble and the more he can pit elders against each other, the more joy he feels about being a "Holy Servant of God."

    Your turn next, brothers and sisters, how are elders appointed by God?

    1 Samuel 16:

    6 When they arrived, Samuel took one look at Eliab and thought, "Surely this is the Lord's anointed!"

    7 But the Lord said to Samuel, "Don't judge by his appearance or height, for I have rejected him. The Lord doesn't see things the way you see them. People judge by outward appearance, but the Lord looks at the heart."

    8 Then Jesse told his son Abinadab to step forward and walk in front of Samuel. But Samuel said, "This is not the one the Lord has chosen." 9 Next Jesse summoned Shimea,[a] but Samuel said, "Neither is this the one the Lord has chosen." 10 In the same way all seven of Jesse's sons were presented to Samuel. But Samuel said to Jesse, "The Lord has not chosen any of these." 11 Then Samuel asked, "Are these all the sons you have?"

    "There is still the youngest," Jesse replied. "But he's out in the fields watching the sheep and goats."

    "Send for him at once," Samuel said. "We will not sit down to eat until he arrives."

    12 So Jesse sent for him. He was dark and handsome, with beautiful eyes.

    And the Lord said, "This is the one; anoint him."

    13 So as David stood there among his brothers, Samuel took the flask of olive oil he had brought and anointed David with the oil. And the Spirit of the Lord came powerfully upon David from that day on. Then Samuel returned to Ramah.

  • heathen
    heathen

    apparently holy spirit is akin to A$$ holes.

  • the truth is mine
    the truth is mine

    The sky fairy’s pixie dust has nothing to do with who does or does not get appointed as an elder. Basically it is based on popularity and need. I can say this with confidence based on personal experience.

    I was appointed as an elder because of a need in the congregation for someone who could actually get something done. For all practical purposes I was a knowledgeable ‘brother’ who was moderate and liked by most of the congregation. I even was able to give talks at the circuit level and toward the end of my time as an elder, at the District level.

    The real kicker is that I have been an atheist since my early teens. I pretty much did and still do whatever I want using caution and common sense to avoid conflict. I only stayed in the organization because of my parents and then family.

    On the other hand, I saw brothers who sincerely wanted to ‘do what’s right’ get railroaded just because they were unpopular with the majority of the serving elders. Many times those serving elders would lie just to get there way.

    So yeah there is nothing to indicate the existence of Holy Spirit in directing the appointment of men in the congregation.

  • RayPublisher
    RayPublisher

    This thread sickens me and there's only three comments lol.

    Many of the elders are sincere and not out for glory or gain. They are Captives to a Concept, just as the rest of us were, right? Some are like the above, but hatred and negativity aren't going to help anyone. That's just how I feel.

    Three strikes and you're out!

  • Phizzy
    Phizzy

    I agree Ray, there are some wonderful Elders and others within the JW's, fine people who I admire for what they are, even though they are as you say Captives of a Concept, or put more bluntly, deluded.

    Of course some are not so wonderful.

    When I questioned a pragmatic Elder I knew in my youth about the role of the Holy Spirit in appointing men , he explained it thus :

    "We look at the qualifications in the bible, we pray about it, and we then look and see how well we think the man measures up, there is no miraculous intervention by the Holy Spirit in this, the Bro measures up, or not, to the standards that the Holy Spirit put in scripture, in our imperfect estimation"

    That is from memory what he said, in other words, the BOE could be really wrong, as the H.S was not actually hands on at work in the process, it had set the standards, that is all.

    Not all JW's look at it that way, but this same guy maintained that prayer only worked by a kind of placebo effect, that it concentrated your mind on the problem. With clear thinking like that it is surprising to me that he is still a JW.

  • Bubblegum Apotheosis
    Bubblegum Apotheosis

    "All It Takes For Evil To Suceed Is For Good Men To Do Nothing". Who said this?

    St. Paul's statement in 1 Timothy 3: creates some very large barriers to entry, to become an overseer of the Hall. The Bible's requirements for entry are very high, but we both know, those are not the ones we need to worry about, it's man made ones we need to become enslaved to.

    Like J.As comments to one elder you know "Unless your spouse adjust her attitude, you won't be an elder" her attidude was not a lack of christian application, it was something J.A did not like! Now, I suppose I lost my cheerfulness of how elders were appointed when I saw personal attacks carried out on long time servants of Jehovah. If there are more good elders than bad, why are the Halls in disaray, people complaining about Shepherding Calls only taking place before a CO comes to town (Or at least one scheduled, until he leaves, it's on our list to do CO!) , to show how much the BOE cares?

    The cowards who were afraid to stand up to the Hall Bully, what can we say about them? Hoorah for keeping a low profile while brothers or sisters are "Pinkertoned" but our body of elders say "We sure work together greatly, if you don't believe, ask the CO himself!" The CO did not know the brother he hand picked for an assembly part, previously handed fliers out in the parkinglot on Apostate material. Once he got his assembly part, he rejoined Jehovah's Happy people and stopped (placing fliers on cars) his work, because he received the glory he wanted! Three of the elders on the body know he did this, but they are to meek to call him on it! Now that's ugly, but how this Org brings out the madness of annointed men!

    Right now we have elders jumping from Hall to Hall, trying to fit into this madness, whether they are "Captive Of A Concept" does not free them of their moral obligation to do justice. During the Neuremberg Trials when Hitler's henchmen attemtped to justify the evil they inflected on their fellow men, their defence "We were obeying Hitler (Captive to the NAZI Concept) and our country!" did not sway the justices, who replied "You should have upheld the higher law of humanity, not blind obedience to evil." End result, they were executed or put in prison for life!

    Unfortunate, ugly or bitter as this might be, there are too many elders who are not willing to challenge the evil deeds taking place, the petty agendas being lobbied against murmuring ones. The saying in business is "Shit Rolls Down Hill, Not Up!" We are not a "Bottom's Up" but a Top's Down Organization, Caste System, Class Distinctions are praised because it sets "Holy Joe" on a pedestal while Sally Slump-in-Hours is looked at as weak, and our silent partner elders will be quick to praise "Holy Joe" over "Sally-Slump-In-Hours" any day. I watched this shit since 1972, and only a few stand out as truly praise worthly and Sheep Caring Men.

  • Bubblegum Apotheosis
  • ziddina
    ziddina
    "Send for him at once," Samuel said. "We will not sit down to eat until he arrives."
    12 So Jesse sent for him. He was dark and handsome, with beautiful eyes.
    And the Lord said, "This is the one; anoint him."..."

    Okay, this is a little off-topic, but...

    Does anyone else besides me, find it a little odd that David's physical beauty is being mentioned here???

  • Zordino
    Zordino

    A Little voice in the Brain's (I use the term Brain Loosely) of the BOE tells them to choose a certain dude for the position of Elder.

    Or perhaps during their decision making process, the BOE smokes/snorts a Lot of "Angel Dust" pun intended

  • still thinking
    still thinking

    LOL....he was obviously loved for more than one reason......spunky little devil that he was...

    anyway...it does seem to contradict somewhat doesn't it?

    "Don't judge by his appearance or height, for I have rejected him. The Lord doesn't see things the way you see them. People judge by outward appearance, but the Lord looks at the heart."

    12 So Jesse sent for him. He was dark and handsome, with beautiful eyes.

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