Does prayer have any effect?

by The Quiet One 56 Replies latest jw experiences

  • N.drew

    If God would intervene in "all the tragedies that happen every minute of every day" there would be no need for "the way, the truth and the life" who is the Son of God. Do you have children cofty? I think you do. Who comes first for you cofty? I know your children do.

  • cofty

    Do you have children cofty? I think you do. Who comes first for you cofty? I know your children do.

    I can't follow your line of reasoning.

  • EntirelyPossible

    God Answers Prayers Of Paralyzed Little Boy

    'No,' Says God

    December 9, 1998 | ISSUE 34•19

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    SAN FRANCISCO–For as long as he can remember, 7-year-old Timmy Yu has had one precious dream: From the bottom of his heart, he has hoped against hope that God would someday hear his prayer to walk again. Though many thought Timmy's heavenly plea would never be answered, his dream finally came true Monday, when the Lord personally responded to the wheelchair-bound boy's prayer with a resounding no.

    Wheelchair-bound Timmy Yu, who finally received his long-awaited reply from God.

    "I knew that if I just prayed hard enough, God would hear me," said the joyful Timmy, surrounded by stuffed animals sent by well-wishing Christians from around the globe, as he sat in the wheelchair to which he will be confined for the rest of his life. "And now my prayer has been answered. I haven't been this happy since before the accident, when I could walk and play with the other children like a normal boy."

    God's response came at approximately 10 a.m. Monday, following a particularly fervent Sunday prayer session by little Timmy. Witnesses said God issued His miraculous answer in the form of a towering column of clouds, from which poured forth great beams of Divine light and the music of the Heavenly Hosts. The miraculous event took place in the Children's Special Care Ward of St. Luke's Hospital, where Timmy goes three times a week for an excruciating two-hour procedure to drain excess fluid from his damaged spinal column.

    Said Angela Schlosser, a day nurse who witnessed the Divine Manifestation: "An incredible, booming voice said to Timmy, 'I am the Lord thy God, who created the rivers and the mountains, the heavens and the earth, the sun and the moon and the stars. Before Me sits My beloved child, whose faith is that of the mustard seed from which grows mighty and powerful things. My child, Timmy Yu, I say unto you thus: I have heard your prayers, and now I shall answer them. No, you cannot get out of your wheelchair. Not ever."

    Paralyzed in a 1996 auto accident that also claimed the lives of both his parents, Timmy has served as a shining example to his fellow churchgoers at Lord In Heaven On High Church, inspiring others with his simple, heartfelt devotion. Now that Timmy has received an answer, Christians the world over are celebrating his story as a stirring testament to the power of faith.

    "The Lord has answered a little boy's plea to know if he would ever walk again, and that answer was no," Rev. H. Newman Gunther of the San Francisco School Of Divinity said. "For years, this boy had been plagued by the question of whether or not he would ever walk, and now Our Lord, in his wisdom and mercy, has forever laid to rest any lingering doubt. Young Timmy can rest assured in the immutable truth that the Lord has bestowed upon him. Now and for all time, he finally knows that he will never escape the cruel prison of his chair of iron, for God hath willed it so. Praise be to God!"


    Asked for comment, God said: "This kind-hearted child's simple prayer hath moved Me. Never before have I seen such faith. His trusting soul, so full of innocent devotion to Me, hath offered seventy times seven prayers asking, 'God? Can I please walk again?' It was indeed right and fitting that I, in My infinite wisdom, should share with him the One True Answer to this long-repeated question he put before Me."

    "My will be done," God added.

    Witnesses to the miracle said Timmy begged God for several minutes to change His mind and heal his shattered vertebrae, but the Lord stood firm.

    "God strongly suggested that Timmy consider praying to one of the other intercessionary agents of Divine power, like Jesus, Mary or maybe even a top saint," Timmy's personal physician, Dr. William Luttrell, said. "The Lord stressed to Timmy that it was a long shot, but He said he might have better luck with one of them."

    Despite all the attention he has received, Timmy remains humble in the face of his newfound notoriety as the only human ever to have a prayer directly answered by God Himself.

    "I know that God loves me, because it says so in the Bible," Timmy said. "So right now, I am just glad that God took the time to answer my prayer. If only I could walk, this would be the greatest day of my life."

  • N.drew
    I can't follow your line of reasoning.

    To whom it belongs is The Son. Are you siding with The Son or with Magic?

    How about this?

    The Way "Listen"

    The Truth "Learn"

    The Life "Be Patient"

    Many generations must be patient. You yourself believe that cofty (evolution). So why do you keep on arguing otherwise?

  • nicolaou

    Not just bullshit - OFFENSIVE BULLSHIT.

  • N.drew

    OK Nicolaou I think you are talking about Timmy Yu or N.drew?

  • tec

    Doesn't that put him in the dock for all the tragedys that happen every minute of every day? How often would the the most trivial action by him prevent needless suffering?

    No it doesn't. To prevent suffering, he would have to be interfering 100% of the time with probably 100% of the people. No one learns anything. No one grows. And there is no free will.

    You can't have it both ways, either god intervenes or he doesn't. If he doesn't he is useless, if he does he is an underachiever at best.

    It seems to me that He does not intervene unless we are willing. On a world wide basis... would that not mean that we all have to be willing?

    You cannot have it both ways either. Forcing himself and His will upon us would make him a tyrant in the eyes of many; not forcing himself and his will upon us makes him weak in the eyes of some.



  • cofty

    N.drew I am even more confused about what you are saying than before.

    Tec - can't you see how risible it is to believe an omnipotent god that cures somebodys athletes foot or finds them a parking space at the mall while ignoring the first rogue cells that will lead to a malignant tumour in a child or the movenent of a plate boundary that will cause a tsunami and result in hundreds of thousands of deaths?

    What a pathetic tinkerer god is.

  • rebel8

    There is a great thing known as The Million Dollar Challenge, which makes debate totally unnecessary.

    At JREF, we offer a one-million-dollar prize to anyone who can show, under proper observing conditions, evidence of any paranormal, supernatural, or occult power or event. The JREF does not involve itself in the testing procedure, other than helping to design the protocol and approving the conditions under which a test will take place. All tests are designed with the participation and approval of the applicant. In most cases, the applicant will be asked to perform a relatively simple preliminary test of the claim, which if successful, will be followed by the formal test. Preliminary tests are usually conducted by associates of the JREF at the site where the applicant lives. Upon success in the preliminary testing process, the "applicant" becomes a "claimant."

    To date, no one has passed the preliminary tests.

    If anyone had any evidence whatsoever that prayer affected health, then they could easily become millionaires.

    No one has even passed preliminary tests of their own design!

  • moshe

    Our mental prayers are caused by electrical nerve impulses initiated by a chemical messenger. There is no evidence that any higher power can read our thoughts nor give spiritual images/inspirations by generating eternally directed electrical messenger signalsin the brain to produce "answers to prayers", or direct humans to carry out a divine plan. Prayer is all a one-sided operation, as six million holocaust victims eternally testify that prayers failed to save them.

  • N.drew

    I believe God has a family. Whether or not God is a real person it makes sense that God will do right by His family first. Just like you.

  • cofty

    it makes sense that God will do right by His family first

    In other words god will heal the athletes foot of a christian but the child with cancer can fuck off.

    Your god is pathetic.

  • N.drew
    In other words god will heal the athletes foot of a christian but the child with cancer can fuck off.

    Nope, wrong again!

    We're not talking about Christians. We're talking about angels.

  • N.drew

    God is a spirit. Spiritual welfare ALWAYS comes before physical welfare because forever is real.

  • cofty

    Nope, wrong again! We're not talking about Christians. We're talking about angels

    Oh that makes more sense then doesn't it?

  • Morbidzbaby

    I believe that prayer is focused energy. So, meditation is the very same thing. You're just focusing your own energy that you have within yourself toward the outcome that you want. This why praying/meditating for a million dollars doesn't work.

    I don't pray, but I do use grounding and focusing techniques when I need to write something that is important and needs to be coherent and intelligent. Some people might laugh when they see me at my laptop with 2 lavender candles lit, an amethyst stone, and essential oils on my forehead... But this is what grounds, centers, and focuses ME. I believe everything has energy (not divine, but scientific). Some of my best writing has been done in this manner because it just assists me in focusing MY energy on the outcome and how I get there. To me, prayer is only different in that it is focused on a PERSONAGE. But it's still YOUR OWN ENERGY that causes your prayer to be "answered" or not. It's your level of focus and willingness to work along with your wants that will determine the outcome in the end. Again, this is why prayer isn't going to get you a shitload of money or a brand new house or that Ferrari that you want. But, the focused energy and your working along with your own desires might just help YOU to make that come true for YOURSELF.

    That's why I get pissed when people credit God or Jehovah with so much. When I was taking classes and working 2 jobs after my ex kicked me out, people said that "Jehovah was providing" and that "I owed so much to Jehovah". Really? Where was he when my ex was kicking me out and taking my children? Where was he when I was homeless? Fuck him! I did it all my damn self! I did the late-night study sessions, the overnight shifts that led into full-day shifts the next day with no sleep, plus meetings and service. I did it. ME! All on my own, with my own energy and my own stamina. I can proudly raise my head high and know that I did it on my own, no invisible sky daddy needed.

  • stillstuckcruz

    Leaving WT: I always said tha about prayer. A striking similiarity to the placebo effect and that is what I believe prayer is. JW's, in particular seem to throw prayer into EVERYTHING. Think you coundn't POSSIBLY have preached to that man without that Holy Spirit? Think there's NO WAY you would have survived that procedure without God? People seem to think their helpless without it. Of course, some believe stronger than others and it's entirely up to them

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