How would you respond to this JWs assertions?

by Vanderhoven7 23 Replies latest watchtower scandals

  • DesirousOfChange
    DesirousOfChange

    Would previous members of your organization still be "dead to JWs" if they had been disfellowshipped for expressing their independent thinking on the subject of organ transplants in the 70s? Let's say they saved the life of one of their children by allowing them to have a kidney transplant when transplants were banned by your organization? If today they are still unrepentant about saving their child, would they be exonerated for having being right and obeying their conscience instead of the Governing Body of Jehovah's Witnesses?

    Vanderhoven, that's a great question to ask!

  • talesin
    talesin

    Glad I could be of assistance.

    I fully support your helping those who are spiritually abused. I know a local pastor who has the same ministry, and though I am not religious myself, have great admiration for those Christians who truly practice love, and try to help others escape / recover from JWs or any other group that is abusive.

    tal

  • MeanMrMustard
    MeanMrMustard

    The response will be interesting... marking thread.

    MeanMrMustard

  • nugget
    nugget

    Bearing in mind the implications of disfellowshipping it would be hoped that only people who committed horrendous acts would be treated in this way. However it is not required to commit a gross sin to be disfellowshipped. It is not necessary to discuss doubts with other withnesses to be disfellowshipped. It is not necessary to sin to be disfellowshipped. With brazen conduct being listed as a reason to DF then elders have carte blanche to act in their own interests.

    If someone no longer believes and tries to leave, does not discuss doubts with others, does not sin they can still be disfellowshipped merely because they do not believe. Elders will visit to force such a declaration from an individual. I made it clear I believed in God and the ransom sacrifice but I did not believe the GB were god's representatives on Earth because of the lies they printed and the way they misquoted sources. How could a God who hates lies support a GB that lies. I was Df'd for apostacy even though I had not expressed my concerns to any other witness at the hall. In fact if they hadn't come and forced the words out then I still would not have expressed them to witnesses at the hall. That is the madness and cruelty of the process.

    If someone stops sinning Elders can still disfellowship them because they sinned in the past and elders do not deem them to be repentant. People have been wrongly Df'd in the past but there is no effort to contact these ones and apologise. How can god be in this process that is open to abuse and is used by individuals to exact vengence.

    The decision to disfellowship is often arbitary, elders children as less likely to be Df'd than rank and file, whether you are pursued by elders is also arbitary.

    If Jesus did not df Judas despite his bad heart condition and murderous actions then by what right do elders think they have greater authority than Jesus. Jehovah says he will judge in the last days so what makes them think they have the right to express God's judgement ahead of time?

    Df'ing is a control mechanism and a way of bullying and threatening the flock. It is cruel and unchristian. If by their fruits you recognise them then this is a rotten fruit from a poisonous tree.

  • Vanderhoven7
    Vanderhoven7

    I see your heart Tal...and I like what I see.

    Thank you.

  • Vanderhoven7
    Vanderhoven7

    Nugget: Mr. Penny is obfuscating at present. I'm hoping to use almost all of your excellent post shortly.

  • Farkel
    Farkel

    : How would you respond to this JWs assertions?

    Never wrestle with a pig. First, you can't win. Second, the pig actually likes it.

    Farkel

  • Vanderhoven7
    Vanderhoven7

    Agreed, we can't win. But Jesus can; truth can; grace can. Besides, I enjoy the wrestling match as well. "For we wrestle not against flesh and blood..."

  • Vanderhoven7
    Vanderhoven7

    Mr Pennyone responded:

    Hi Vander

    >>Are Jehovah's Witnesses required to shun parents or sibblings who have been disfellowshipped for the gross sin of smoking?<<

    A Christian should have no SPIRITUAL contact with one who is disfellowshipped, family or not.

    It doesn't negate family ties though. But such ones are no longer viewed as "spiritual" brothers, sisters, parents.

    A sad situation for all concerned.

    >>Would previous members of your organization still be "dead to JWs" if they had been disfellowshipped for expressing their independent thinking on the subject of organ transplants in the 70s? Let's say they saved the life of one of their children by allowing them to have a kidney transplant when transplants were banned by your organization? If today they are still unrepentant about saving their child, would they be exonerated for having being right and obeying their conscience instead of the Governing Body of Jehovah's Witnesses?<<

    Yes. When mistakes are made and found out we admit them and correct them.

    And we would reach out to anyone affected by decisions made based on past information that had been corrected of adjusted.

    much Christian love

    1pennyone

  • Vanderhoven7
    Vanderhoven7

    Question: Does anyone know of a person being disfellowshipped for having an organ transplant other a blood transfusion?

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