Modern Bet Hillel and Bet Shamai?

WontLeave

Well, that was odd... Got posted without content, but can't edit. Oh, well, as I was saying...

I was going to reply to another post, but this got too far off topic. I've been looking into Unitarian Universalism. From what I can find about their official doctrine, it's pretty sound. Unfortunately, they don't really make their beliefs widely known, so it's hard to really nail down what they believe. Add to that the extremely liberal adherence requirements (none at all) and what the members believe has zero to do with the official doctrine. That being said, I'm pretty sure going to a UU church is nearly useless, as what are they going to preach when they don't really believe anything concrete? I have to sit through enough garbage I don't believe and know isn't true at the Kingdom Hall.

It appears that the JWs are the modern Bet Shimai, adding burden to God's Word; whereas UUs are the modern Bet Hillel, ignoring many of God's stated standards. Jesus went after both groups when he was on the earth. Is anyone aware of any UU teachings (other than whatever you want to do is cool) that are in stark contrast with Scripture, so I can remove it from the table? Or, is anyone aware of a church with a doctrine similar to JWs/UUs that isn't an evil power-hungry monster or hippie/Wicca/lesbian festival gone amok? No offence to hippie Wiccan lesbians; I'm sure you're a lot of fun to hang around with, but that's just not my scene. Between JW judgmentalism and UU total religious anarchy, there must be some sanity in the vast grey area.

TD

It appears that the JWs are the modern Bet Shimai, adding burden to God's Word; whereas UUs are the modern Bet Hillel, ignoring many of God's stated standards. Jesus went after both groups when he was on the earth.

Could you elaborate?

james_woods

Maybe true religious sanity does not exist on the linear continuum between the JW and the UU; but somewhere outside of that line.

(thinking outside the box sometimes works wonders)

WontLeave

Could you elaborate?

UU is pretty much total moral and doctrinal anarchy. Supposedly, they do have a doctrine, but it's so optional that they don't really seem to talk about it. From what little I can find on their beliefs, they seem to match Scripture, but at first glance, JWs seem to match Scripture. It's only after you've been exposed to the deeper layers that you discover the darkness, lies, and terrible attitude among JWs.

Maybe true religious sanity does not exist on the linear continuum between the JW and the UU; but somewhere outside of that line.

I'm a little different than most JWs. Nobody came to me and taught me. I read several "holy" books, including the Bible. The Bible rung the most truthful and I saught out what church was teaching what the Bible said. JWs seemed to have it closest. It wasn't until later that I discovered the power structure they deny exists, the little nitpicky beliefs they don't talk about very often that don't match the Bible, and the open worship of the GB and "organization".

JW and UU main doctrine seem to be about the same, but one is all about total, unquestioned human control ruling over the congregation and the other is totally devoid of any structure whatsoever. I'm not interested in churches that teach contrary to the Bible. While I realize no earthly church is going to be perfect, there are limits to what is acceptable doctrine and worship.

TD

WontLeave,

My interest was in your commentary on Judaism

In what way did Hillel the elder and his disciples ignore "many of God's stated standards"?

In what way did Jesus go after them?

james_woods

I'm not interested in churches that teach contrary to the Bible.

JWs seemed to have it closest.

If you can tolerate the occasional false prophecy.

(which, by the way, is totally against biblical standards)

Nickolas

It sounds like another flavour of religious assertion without substantiation. Conjecture, at best.

WontLeave

In what way did Hillel the elder and his disciples ignore "many of God's stated standards"?

Moreover it was said, ‘Whoever divorces his wife, let him give her a certificate of divorce.’ However, I say to YOU that everyone divorcing his wife, except on account of fornication, makes her a subject for adultery, and whoever marries a divorced woman commits adultery. - Mat 5:31-32

the House of Hillel allowed divorce for even trivial offenses, such as burning a meal. - Wikipedia, source: Babylonian Talmud (Talmud Bavli), tractate Gittin, 90a

From what I've read, while Bet Hillel and Bet Shammai had many, many disagreements, precious few are specifically recorded in Talmud. Where Jesus comments on heavy rules imposed by men, we can assume it's Shammai and where Jesus comments on God's standards being lowered by men, we can assume it's Hillel.

According to this source, "it was said, ' The school of Shammai binds; the school of Hillel looses.' "

cyberjesus

It appears that the JWs are the modern Bet Shimai, adding burden to God's Word; whereas UUs are the modern Bet Hillel, ignoring many of God's stated standards

So you are getting Gods words and standards from the bible? Then you need to look for a religion who uses only the bible, UU does not promote the bible only, they respect all the "holy" books, its not about doctrine, its about fellowship and spirituality.. The reason it doesnt appeal to you its because you are looking in the wrong place to begin with.

What you are doing is looking for a religion that matches with your beliefs..... not necessarily with Gods words.... Because unless you are a literallist Gods words will be subject to interpretation by the group you join.

My advice is to re-reseach your holy books... with a critical eye. Start with the Bible. and go from there.

Modern Bet Hillel and Bet Shamai?

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