"We are all atheists ...

by Nickolas 49 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • Nickolas
    Nickolas

    ... about most of the gods that societies have ever believed in. Some of us just go one god further."

    Dawkins raises a point which some, if not many, theists will dismiss as irrelevant, but I am not exactly sure why. Of course Thor doesn't exist, even though for millennia an entire civilisation believed he did. Same goes for Ra, Jupiter, Posseidon, Huitzilopochtli, Baal and another 1,600 or so gods worshipped by millions of our ancestors. We can say without fear of contradiction that we in the modern world do not believe in those ancient gods and in that strict context we are atheistic toward them. And we are atheistic toward them for the same reason billions of us are theistic toward the Abrahamic god. Because we have been told what to believe and taught not to question for fear, deep and dark, that we will be lost to the Abyss if we do.

    Not only are we all atheists in a contextual sense, 1,600 +/- 1, we were all born atheists in a global sense. We were born believing in no gods. If we exchange a child born to Christian parents in Birmingham for a child born to Buddhist parents in Ulan Bator, what those children will come to believe will be much different from what they would have believed otherwise. The reason is evident. What we believe and do not believe is instilled in us by the accidental situations of our births and upbringing. We had no choice in the matter, and most modern religions steadfastly forbid that choice to us while we live out our lives.

    Some of us have come to believe the world would be a better place if the people in it would examine what they have been told to believe without prejudice. It's never easy to do, but is generally worthwhile and emancipating. Some of us keep our faith in God but free ourselves from the shackles of oppressive religious organisations. Some of us just go one god further.

  • leavingwt
    leavingwt

    (I don't have a horse in this race.)

    IMHO, Nick, the 'Personal Revelation' is the largest obstacle to this line of reasoning.

  • d
    d

    True.Believing in God is a hinderance to progress.

  • Nickolas
    Nickolas

    Perhaps the only obstacle, lwt. But if all those personal revelations involving those 1,600 gods were illusions, what differentiates a personal revelation involving Yahweh?

  • whereami
    whereami

    So logical so clear but still, the delusional brainwashed mind will not see it. Very sad.

    This is so true:

    "Religion is, indeed, the self-consciousness and self-esteem of man who has either not yet won through to himself, or has already lost himself again. Religion is the sigh of the oppressed creature, the heart of a heartless world, and the soul of soulless conditions. It is the opium of the people. The abolition of religion as the illusory happiness of the people is the demand for their real happiness. To call on them to give up their illusions about their condition is to call on them to give up a condition that requires illusions. The criticism of religion is, therefore, in embryo, the criticism of that vale of tears of which religion is the halo".

  • cyberjesus
    cyberjesus

    Is hard to let go the love of fairies... We are still at a very primitive stage of civilization. As time progresses and we loose the need to have a big daddy protecting us. When we understand that we are on our own and feel no fear about it we will be able to solve the problems of mankind that we expect God to solve for us.

    We need to God to solve the problems we cant solve... but its the belief in God that prevents us from solving most of those problems.

  • unshackled
    unshackled

    What we believe and do not believe is instilled in us by the accidental situations of our births and upbringing.

    Why don't believers see the fact that their ideology of choice was decided at birth by means of geography? If you are born in North America chances are you are Christian. If born in the Middle East chances are you are Muslim. Then they defiantly defend their particular brand of ideology as if they've scrutinized all possiblities. But they haven't. They just accepted the "reality" that was presented to them by their parents. They weren't born believing ANY of it.

    If you raise a child closed off from society on top of a mountain, and tell that child one certain tree is a god and creator of the universe, that child will grow up believing it.

  • DanaBug
    DanaBug
    When we understand that we are on our own and feel no fear about it we will be able to solve the problems of mankind that we expect God to solve for us.

    I agree, especially when I look around at the amazing things we've done so far. No God involved, just humans. We're capable of so much. It's time for humankind to grow up. I hope I see it in my lifetime.

  • maninthemiddle
    maninthemiddle
    IMHO, Nick, the 'Personal Revelation' is the largest obstacle to this line of reasoning.

    Sorry, I don't understand, what do you mean by personal revelation?

    I think you may mean that they feel a connection to Jesus or God.

    I look at all the many gods the Romans had. They thought they had influence on their lives, not sure if there was anything "personal" going on there, but they were dependant on them, and thanked them when things went right and blamed then when things went wrong.

    I don't see anymore "proof' of their gods than Abraham's god.

    Growing up with JW parents, you certainly didn’t have any chance to learn about other religions, it was completely the chance of who you were born to.

    There was no opportunity to learn what others believed.

    Does reading “Mankind’s Search for God” count?

  • leavingwt
    leavingwt
    I think you may mean that they feel a connection to Jesus or God.

    There are members of this forum who hear the audible voice of Christ. They carry on DIRECT, TWO-WAY conversations with him.

    This is what I'm talking about. They may admit that this personal revelation is sufficient for them alone, but it's more than enough "proof" for them that their God is real, unlike Thor, etc.

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