Question for Billy The Ex-Bethelite and others who had forgone college sometime ago.

by garyneal 34 Replies latest jw friends

  • garyneal

    Expanded-mind: Glad to see that you are back in college. I can only imagine how your folks must have felt back when they were trying to get you to go to college earlier. Your persecution complex must have been pegging then.

    misery loves elders: I remember shortly after I started college going back to that old Indy Fundy church that I had stopped attending for a while. His rants and tirades made me so bitter that I never returned to that church again. While the pastor did not speak out against college, I can at least see how stupid religion can get and can somewhat sympathize with the lady you spoke of who was attending college and decided not to return after that embarrassing meeting. Legalists ultimately cause their own demise because of the way they way overstep their bounderies.

    MMXIV: Congratulations for sticking it out in spite of the odds.

    Soldier77: Yeah, my wife's arguments are indeed weak. Personally, I think she just does not really get how hard it is out there. She's been lucky in that I had my degree when we met and when we moved to find better jobs, I was able to find something quickly and advance in it. She's also lucky too in that she found a job that will pay for her college. But she is talking about quitting or at least just hanging on until 2012, whether she graduates or not, because after that year her grant money runs out. I've been trying to encourage her to keep pushing and get that degree by 2012 but between her burnout and what has to be her religious peers possibly discouraging her, I feel like I am in a no win scenario. Witnesses are so warped in their thinking about college, I hope my daughter does not turn out this way.

    OMG: I remember going to an assembly in Richmond where they made an example of a young girl who was very smart and doing quite well in HS. Her guidance counselor was urging her to attend college and seek out grants but this young girl gave it all up to serve Jehovah. At another assembly, a young boy was made an example out of who had an opportunity to attend college but instead gave it up so he can work at his father's (wait for it......) window washing company.

    thetrueone: Keep the underlings ignorant, much easier to control them. So, so true.

    babygirl30: From what I understand about what causes stress in families, one thing that seems to be so clear is that money problems cause a considerable amount of stress. While living the simple life helps, so does having a job that actually earns you a good salary. I've read articles that state that couples who were college educated were happier as they had less of the stresses that people with only HS diplomas or less had. You know, those money problems that come from working a minimum wage job?

    gubberningbody: That is so true as college certainly broke me from the influence of my narrow minded influence of that old Indy Fundy church. The Christians at college were so much more open minded than the Christians I remembered from that church. They are the main reason why I remain a Christian today.

    long hair girl: At times, I think my wife too is speaking from her own ignorance. Her sister is much less ignorant about how the world works than she is sometimes. I guess that is because her sister is a single mom who has to fend for herself.

    I quit: Your wife's job sounds like my wife's job. They are requiring degrees now where they did not use to. I do hope my wife makes it to graduation by 2012 for if she does not, then the grant money will run out and she will most likely quit school. If she does that, she may find out the hard reality of not being able to teach because they are requiring the very college degree that she missed out on getting for free.

    Pistoff: The society shoots its own self in the foot when it rails against college like it does. Other religions do allow it and they do survive. The pastor at my church even celebrated it one time by lining up all the people who were graduating college and honored them. Not all of those people were in Bible college or getting degrees in divinity either, some were in secular colleges getting degrees to do secular work. Evidently, the Watchtower Society does not know what the body of Christ really is.

    wannabefree: They're really speaking out of both sides of their mouths.

  • garyneal

    Billy, I told my wife about your plight. I think in some small way, she does acknowledge that some people's stories are 'perhaps' legitamite. But she always asks what the other side has to say. Always skeptical of anyone who says anything negative about the org but never skeptical of anything said by the org that berates anyone else.

    For one thing, you are right in that my wife did not believe that you were somehow 'encouraged' to leave Bethel due to your health problems. Poor child, she still believes that the people at Bethel are noble. Truth be told, given what I've seen in the world and given the fact that I am somewhat cynical, I can believe that any organization would 'encourage' people who are a 'burden' to them to leave. Of course, she agrees that the people of the 'world' would do that, but not the fine people at Bethel, no way....

    Billy, I was unable to pull up that Awake article on my wife's CD because (wouldn't you know it) that CD only goes as far back as 1970.

    It's a shame that 'Satan's system' helps you in ways that 'God's organization' is suppose to be helping you in. I remember feeling that way a lot too when it seems like people who were not religious were a lot nicer than people who went to that old Indy Fundy church. Of course, you and I both know the spin these groups put on that. "The world is nice to its own but if you were living for God, the world would hate you." Massive persecution complex this creates. Fortunately, I've moved beyond that nonsense.

    How's college life so far?

  • garyneal

    Anne: well said and your comments show the hypocrisy of their whole stance on higher education. Yours and Billy's that is. They don't want you to go to college but that love you and want to advance you once you have your degree.

    Jamie: Yes, my wife did comment on why she now goes to college. When it was the community college, she loved it and said it was because she wanted to teach and she enjoyed the journey. Now that it is a university, she laments it and says that she is only in it because "they are making her go." In a way she is right, but she did agree to the terms when she signed on for the job about two years ago. A lot of her frustration is coming from the fact that she wants to be more 'spiritual' as well as spend more time at home with the family (especially her daughter who I am now very close with). Plus she is now pregnant and is about to have a second child. She's exhausted and burned out to be sure but I am still trying to encourage her as I know this will pay off big for her in the future and she only has until 2012 to finish.

    elderelite: I try to get my wife to agree with the idea of starting a college fund for my daughter. She is opposed to it reasoning that our daughter will just blow it on something frivolous when she reaches college age. It's possible, but I know how hard it was for me to go to college and work full time and my wife should know how hard it is since she goes to college, works full time, and has a family. I told my wife that I wanted to spare our daughter that trouble and said that I wished my parents had done the same. She won't budge but I finally told her that I was not waiting on her to go along with it. She lamented it but came to realize that I meant it.

  • just n from bethel
    just n from bethel

    Gary - about that college fund - look into 529 plans - your daughter can only use it for education, in other words it would be difficult for her to blow it.

    Also - more info for your wife is that all JWs know the watchtower talks about how university is mainly for worldly careers - and to seek out high-paying jobs, etc. - She should agree with that or she's blocking out what they say at assemblies and in the publications. However, all education professionals will clear up this misconception right away - she should know herself really: a university education is about learning how to think - how to really use your mind. I was fortunate enough to go because my high school had a joint program for the first two years with the local U. So my parents didn't really object because it was like I was still in HS. I ended up graduating from a different U some years later because I put my last two years of University education on hold after I graduted from high school. Why? - to do full time service of course!

    Anyway - education is an interesting subject. I have had many conversations with many elders that absolutely plan on sending their kids to college. WT can say whatever it wants - but I can tell you right now, privately this matter is something that many feel the org is wrong on. I heard a GB member just two years ago at a Special Assembly - give that illustration about shooting a tumor out with a gun...he compared that to going to college. That was another big nail for me.

  • St George of England
    St George of England

    I went to College on leaving school in 1963. After two years full time study the CO badgered me into leaving rather than complete my final year. He said Armageddon would definitely be here before I finished in a years time and if not within months of my finishing. I was young, stupid and influenced by this idiot and my parents supported his view not mine. Needless to say I bitterly regretted that decision.

    I got married in 1970 and with the help of my wife saved money to allow me to go to Uni and get a degree and MSc, a decision we never regretted.

    Never let anyone tell you the WTS does not discourage College/Uni! All the decisions I have made in life that were a mistake and that I have come to regret are those when I followed the WTS. All the decisions that have worked out well are when we totally ignored the WTS


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