Did any bishops or cardinals change scripture during the early church years?

by TTWSYF 17 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • freydo
    freydo

    Paul mentions that Gentiles are not under those laws.

    The name of God is still hallowed, by that we mean all that God's name means and entails, not just some letters.

    So Paul made a new religion. Out with the old and in with the new. Except, the New Covenant was to be made with Israel and not gentiles or jw's. Where is it foretold that there would be a new religion with thousands of sects after Yahushua ascended?

    I'm not sure what the question is concerning "halleluy(j)ah"

    Hallelujah (disambiguation) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia. Jump to: navigation, search. Hallelujah is a Hebrew word meaning "Praise Yahweh". Hallelujah may also refer to: ... en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hallelujah_(disambiguation)

    Why is it not spelled the way it's pronounced? J in English is not pronounced Y

    And the son who carries his father's name doesn't cut your neighbor's grass or eat ham sandwiches.

  • PSacramento
    PSacramento
    So Paul made a new religion. Out with the old and in with the new. Except, the New Covenant was to be made with Israel and not gentiles or jw's. Where is it foretold that there would be a new religion with thousands of sects after Yahushua ascended?

    Peter and the other apostles seemed to accept his "new religion" just fine, with a few minor issues that were resolved, accordig to Paul's views by the way.

    Jesus said HE was the way, the only way, to God. He didn't say there was onlY ONE WAY to Him though, even though there is and THAT way is love.

    I'm not sure what the question is concerning "halleluy(j)ah"

    No question, just showing that the "name" of God is in the NT and that God didn't allow it to be removed or what not, it is where it is suppose to be according to God's will and if it is God's will that "all shall honour the Son like the father" and that it is Jesus name and "no other name under the heavens that grants salvation" then it is GOD's will.

  • PSacramento
    PSacramento
    Whenever the F.F.Bruce or Bruce Metzger books come in to Half Price Books where I work I always check them out.
    They are the pillars of the Baptist theology it seems.

    Really? even though Metzger does NOT believe the bible to be inerrant?

  • dgp
    dgp

    In his "Misquoting Jesus", Bart Ehrman says that "copyists", purposefully or not, made changes to the Bible. I was not there to make those changes, but this statement hasn't been denied; at least not that I know of. But, in my humble opinion, the question of whether someone made changes to the Bible is not the first question you should ask yourself about the Bible. The first question should be whether you should believe that it's the Word of God. For that purpose, all analysis of the book as a historical book, that is, who wrote it, when, what the text reveals about the writer, et cetera, should be free to pursue. Analyses such as the fact that God seems to have very bad morals, as, for example, when he killed all of Pharaoh's troops, he sent the plagues, had the male and non-virgin madianites killed and the virgin madianites taken hostages and raped, et cetera, that should also be a valid point in someone freely determining whether that is God's word.

    You should also why some books made it into the Bible and why others's didn't. What criteria they used to determine which books had been inspired by God and which books hadn't.

    Then you can question whether someone, anyone, made changes to the Bible. And at that point you will get to Ehrman's uncomfortable question, whether you can truly believe that God wouldn't see to it that His Word were preserved.

  • freydo
    freydo

    Paul mentions that Gentiles are not under those laws.

    Where is this stated?

    And where is it stated that Jewish believers stopped observing those laws. Were there to be two laws?

    One for gentiles and one for Jews?

    Matt 5:17 "Do not think that I have come to do away with or undo the Law..." AMP

    Ex 12:49 "There shall be one law for the native-born and for the stranger or foreigner who sojourns among you."

  • TTWSYF
    TTWSYF

    Good points made by all. So it appears that there is no proof that scriture was tampered with, but obviously, [plenty of] opinion on it.

    Something that I'm surprised at is that no one has brought up is that the whole bible [not just the new testament] is all based on an oral tradition. Moses wrote the first 5 books of the old testament generations after Adam and Eve, Noah, Jacob, Abraham, Joseph etc etc. all based on the oral traditions. The apostles write thanks for keeping the traditions that they had handed down so why would anyone believe that it could possibly be the word of God based on such loose guidelines?

    I believe it is because there is no other book [ancient or otherwise] which moves people to such a degree. There is a reason that the bible is the most popular book in the world. The reason is because it is the word of God and when ever someone tries to change it, people [who know, who have the Holy Ghost alive in them] shout and make it known that there is a problem. Of course that is my catholic view. No offense to anyones opinion intended.

    respectfully,

    dc

  • dgp
    dgp

    There is evidence that the Bible was tampered with. Have you ever heard of the Johannine Comma (http://www.bible-researcher.com/comma.html? I understand it was Eramus of Rotterdam who added this text to support the trinity. But then, if he could do that, will you honestly believe that no other person ever tampered with the Bible? I can tell you this, TTWSYF, as a former Catholic.

  • freydo
    freydo

    connect the dots....Islam, the Vatican and Masons

    "What I'm going to tell you is what I learned in secret briefings in the Vatican when I was a Jesuit priest, under oath and induction. A Jesuit cardinal named Augustine Bea showed us how desperately the Roman Catholics wanted Jerusalem at the end of the third century. Because of its religious history and its strategic location, the Holy City was considered a priceless treasure. A scheme had to be developed to make Jerusalem a Roman Catholic city.

    "The great untapped source of manpower that could do this job was the children of Ishmael. The poor Arabs fell victim to one of the most clever plans ever devised by the powers of darkness. Early Christians went everywhere with the gospel setting up small churches, but they met heavy opposition. Both the Jews and the Roman government persecuted the believers in Christ to stop their spread. But the Jews rebelled against Rome, and in 70 AD, Roman armies under General Titus smashed Jerusalem and destroyed the great Jewish temple which was the heart of Jewish worship...in fulfillment of Christ's prophecy in Matthew 24:2. "On this holy placed today where the temple once stood, the Dome of the Rock Mosque stands as Islam's second most holy place. Sweeping changes were in the wind. Corruption, apathy, greed, cruelty, perversion and rebellion were eating at the Roman Empire, and it was ready to collapse. The persecution against Christians was useless as they continued to lay down their lives for the gospel of Christ. "The only way Satan could stop this thrust was to create a counterfeit "Christian" religion to destroy the work of God. The solution was in Rome. Their religion had come from ancient Babylon and all it needed was a face-lift. This didn't happen overnight, but began in the writings of the 'early church fathers'. "It was through their writings that a new religion would take shape. The statue of Jupiter in Rome was eventually called St. Peter, and the statue of Venus was changed to the Virgin Mary. The site chosen for its headquarters was on one of the seven hills called 'Vaticanus', the place of the diving serpent where the Satanic temple of Janus stood. "The great counterfeit religion was Roman Catholicism, called 'Mystery, Babylon the Great, the Mother of Harlots and Abominations of the Earth'- Revelation 17:5. She was raised up to block the gospel, slaughter the believers in Christ, establish religions, create wars and make the nations drunk with the wine of her fornication as we will see.
    Three major religions have one thing in common - each has a holy place where they look for guidance. Roman Catholicism looks to the Vatican as the Holy City. The Jews look to the wailing wall in Jerusalem, and the Muslims look to Mecca as their Holy City. Each group believes that they receive certain types of blessings for the rest of their lives for visiting their holy place. In the beginning, Arab visitors would bring gifts to the 'House of God', and the keepers of the Kaaba were gracious to all who came. Some brought their idols and, not wanting to offend these people, their idols were placed inside the sanctuary. It is said that the Jews looked upon the Kaaba as an outlying tabernacle of the Lord with veneration until it became polluted with idols............."

    http://www.remnantofgod.org/books/docs/How-the-Vatican-Created-Islam.pdf

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