What makes an apostate...

by IronHill 13 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • IronHill
    IronHill

    an apostate for witnesses?

    I only ask because we have had several conversations with family members who want to make sure we have not become "apostates". A rumor has been going around that we have become, sign carrying, picketing kh's attending, leaflet printing apostates. We have explained to our family members that we are living our lives now our way, but we are not speaking out on the organization. They were all ok with that.

    We were under the impression that if you disassociate yourself and practice pagan beliefs (for them, like holidays and such) that in their book of rules we are apostates. Apparently that's not what our family thinks?

    So what makes an apostate an apostate for the witnesses??

  • stillin
    stillin

    that seems to be up for personal interpretation. It goes anywhere from speaking out against the organization to answering a paragraph too much in your own words in the watchtower or book study.

    If you go to any other church, that is definitely setting yourself up to be called apostate.

    If you speculate about anything that hasn't been addressed in the publications, you may be an apostate.

    In general terms, thinking is an apostate act, but thank goodness, people can't tell what you're thinking.

  • Darth plaugeis
    Darth plaugeis

    If you question the actions of an elder..........You might be an apostate

    If you doubt 1914..........You might be an apostate

    If you've never gone to Bethel for a visit ..........You might be an apostate

    If the Generation thing has got your head spinning ..........You might be an apostate

    If you don't read the new book released at the convention THAT NIGHT ..........You might be an apostate

    sorry to make light of this, but I remember so many pointing to others using the APOSTATE word for the stupidest things.

    I thought it was if you deliberately go against the Holy Spirit or Jehovah, or am I confusing something else, it has been awhile.

  • Alwayshere
    Alwayshere

    Elder's Book-"Payattention to the flock" "Apostasy includes people who deliberatly spread(stubbornly hold to and speak about teachings contray to Bible truths as taught by JWS are Apostates."

  • Black Sheep
    Black Sheep

    An announcement from the platform that IronHill is no longer a Jehovah's Witness should do it.

    Cheers

    Chris

  • civicsi00
    civicsi00

    Let's not forget that Ray Franz also pointed out in that letter sent out to elders in 1980 that "simply believing" (as in, inside their head and not sharing it with others) something other than what's officially doctrine, one could be considered an apostate. The GB will go to great lengths to smear anyone who doesn't believe in them.

  • WTWizard
    WTWizard

    A true apostate is one that actively opposes the religion, after knowing the doctrines about it and having once been an active member. One can actively oppose by picketing, but teaching that it is wrong and sowing doubts on purpose also qualify as opposing. Also, showing others where they can get Zero Dollar Bills and Void Checks (and Monopoly money) for the Worldwide Pedophile Defense Fund would be in opposition to the religion.

    Trouble is, they now define "apostasy" as merely questioning a key doctrine. Even a minor one. That, to me, is not the same as real apostasy--a person can stay in an organization that is 85% correct and valuable, 10% questionable, and 5% incorrect and still get value out of it. They will question the 5% that is wrong, and if they were allowed to simply disregard that portion, all would be well. They treat that as apostasy, however--usually resulting in the person starting to question everything and starting to oppose the whole religion. That they hold families hostage for that last 5% also helps them go from merely questioning the few bad doctrines to actively opposing the religion.

    And, this is totally unnecessary. No organization run by people is ever going to be perfect. But, if you are allowed to discuss things, you improve the paradigm. Discussion of the 85% that is good can make it even better. Discussing the 10% that is marginal reduces wasteful doctrines and could prevent stupid rules from developing in the future. And, discussing the 5% that is blatantly wrong eliminates the problems, so the organization gets better (one organization I support is about like this--they allow open discussion, resulting in continuing and ongoing improvements. The only item I could find that was blatantly wrong was encouraging use of aspartame instead of sugar--suggesting using Stevia instead improves it, along with improving their health, without undercutting it. The same suggestion among the witlesses would have been classified "apostate", and undercut the fragile faith.)

  • wobble
    wobble

    Good post Wizzie,

    It shows why the WT is an anachronistic 19th century religion ,set in its ways as if in concrete. They have an inbuilt mechanism to stop any progress, this is ,they say, to keep "The truth" pure, but we all know it is to keep firm control of the faithful,and to keep the dollars rolling in, and to maintain the myth that God's Spirit directs them.

    I think Ironhill, and the rest of us faders, are always in danger of being labelled Apostates, by the WT or the local Elders, for just not supporting the silly cult.

    When you look at religions and organizations in the past, you realise that "Apostates" were usually the ones who brought about progress and beneficial change, but of course they cut away at, or completely destroyed , the power of incumbent Rulers.

    That is what worries the GB, losing their position, and cosseted lifestyle.

    Wobble

  • Mickey mouse
    Mickey mouse

    In reality: Anyone they want to blackball.

  • LatinxJW
    LatinxJW

    ^^^^^

    What Mickey said

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