When are anointed who die before Armageddon resurrected as per the Watchtower?

by ThomasCovenant 23 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • jonathan dough
    jonathan dough

    From: http://144000.110mb.com/144000/i-5.html#VI

    VI. The first resurrection did not begin in 1918 with the resurrection of the 144,000 to heaven, and salvation is not granted based on deeds performed in accordance with new rules and regulations during the 1,000 year reign. [Home]

    The Jehovah’s Witnesses teach that the first resurrection, for the 144,000 only, began in 1918 and will conclude shortly (Revelation Climax, 103, 277), a theory at drastic odds with Revelation 20:4-6.

    4 And I saw thrones, and there were those who sat down on them, and power of judging was given them. Yes, I saw the souls of those executed with the ax for the witness they bore to Jesus and for speaking about God, and those who had worshiped neither the wild beast nor its image and who had not received the mark upon their forehead and upon their hand. And they came to life and ruled as kings with the Christ for a thousand years. 5 (The rest of the dead did not come to life until the thousand years were ended.) This is the first resurrection. 6 Happy and holy is anyone having part in the first resurrection; over these the second death has no authority, but they will be priests of God and of the Christ, and will rule as kings with him for the thousand years.( Rev. 20:4-6 NWT)

    Admittedly confusing, these verses have been debated by religious scholars for centuries with respect to which “coming to life” event is the first resurrection. It is obviously not 1918 before the Great Tribulation, before the entire book of Revelation for that matter. Rather, the first resurrection will be associated with a) the first "coming to life” event, b) the second “coming to life” event, c) both events, d) during the thousand year reign, or e) after the thousand year reign. It leaves no room for a 1918 first resurrection.

    The Jehovah’s Witnesses reject these ‘coming to life’ events as being the first resurrection, especially the second event where the rest of the dead do not come to life until the thousand years are over.

    As clearly stated, it is not “the rest of the dead” who share in the first resurrection. That resurrection is for those who rule with Christ for the thousand years. (Reasoning, 338.) Who, then, are “the rest of the dead?” They are all those of mankind who died as a result of Adamic sin and those who, though survivors of the great tribulation or those who may be born during the Millennium, need to be relieved of the death-dealing effects of such sin. - Compare Ephesians 2:1. In what sense do they not “come to life” until the end of the thousand years? This does not mean their resurrection. This ‘coming to life’ involves much more than merely existing as humans. It means attaining to human perfection, free from all effects of Adamic sin. Notice that the reference to this in verse 5 occurs immediately after the preceding verse says that those who will be in heaven “came to life.” In their case it means life free from all effects of sin; they are even specially favored with immortality. (1 Cor 15:54) For the rest of the dead,” then it must mean the fullness of life in human perfection. (Reasoning, 339) (emphasis added)

    For them, the first ‘coming to life’ event only refers to the spiritual condition of those sharing in the 1918 first resurrection of the 144,000, but on closer inspection their interpretation is neither scriptural nor possible. Earlier it was established that the 1914 kingdom date was unsustainable and events associated with that date belonged in the first century, that the Second Coming of Christ did not happen in 1914 but lies ahead, and consequently the first resurrection of 1 Thessalonians 4:16, 17, and 1 Corinthians 15:22, 23 which follows closely and is tightly bound to the return or Second Coming, must also lie in the future, not 1918.

    Never-the-less, the Jehovah’s Witnesses make an effort to place the beginning of the first resurrection of the 144,000 in 1918, and even go so far as to base their theory of an “earlier” resurrection in Philippians 3:11 on the fact that the Greek word exanastasis can mean getting out of bed in the morning; thus it is an early resurrection, a very weak argument, at best. They claim:

    First resurrection. Revelation 20:5, 6 refers to the resurrection of those who will reign with Christ as "the first resurrection." The apostle Paul speaks of this first resurrection also as "the earlier resurrection from the dead [literally, the out-resurrection the out of dead (ones)]." Php 3:11, NW, Ro Int) ... Paul is not denying a general resurrection by this language, but emphasizing that of believers." Charles Ellicott's Commentaries (1865, Vol. II, p. 87) remarks on Philippians 3:11: "' The resurrection from the dead;' i.e., as the context suggests, the first resurrection (Rev. xx. 5), when at the Lord's coming the dead in Him shall rise first (1 Thessalon. iv. 16), and the quick be caught up to meet Him in the clouds (1 Thess. iv. 17); compare Luke xx. 35. The first resurrection will include only true believers, and will apparently precedes the second, that of non-believers and disbelievers, in point of time ... Any reference here to a merely ethical resurrection (Cocceius) is wholly out of the question." One of the basic meanings of the word exanastasis is getting up from bed in the morning; thus it can well represent a resurrection occurring early, otherwise called "the first resurrection.' Rotherham's translation of Philippians 3:11 reads: "If by any means I may advance to the earlier resurrection which is from the dead." (Insight, 787)

    But this is not true. A literal translation makes no reference to an earlier resurrection but simply reads “… if somehow I may attain to the resurrection from the dead” (Phil. 3:11) (Same NAB and KJV.) The Jehovah’s Witnesses’ reliance on an 1865 commentary by Charles Ellicott does not advance their cause. Even though he sees two resurrections, he ties the first to the Second Coming and places no date on either event, let alone 1918.

    If Ellicott is not a Jehovah’s Witness it is doubtful that he believes the Second Coming happened in 1914 and the first resurrection began in 1918. And if that is the case he would place the first resurrection of believers during the thousand year reign and the second of non-believers after the thousand year reign which is at direct odds with the Jehovah’s Witnesses. Furthermore, since Ellicott’s second resurrection only includes non-believers and disbelievers, that will include by necessity resurrected members of the Great Crowd who do not survive the Great Tribulation, and Abraham, Moses and Isaiah etc. N. Turner on the other hand comments “Elsewhere the NT does not envisage two resurrections, which are an invention of this (another) author (Peake‘s Commentaries, 1057).

    And just because Rotherham inserted the word ‘earlier’ into Philippians 3:11 in his amplified Bible, that is not enough to overcome the overwhelming weight of scriptural authority to the contrary. Philippians 3:11 does not say there is an earlier resurrection. The Jehovah’s Witnesses are merely using one other person’s error as precedent. One is reminded of Jesus’ warning at Matthew 15:14: “If a blind person leads a blind person, both will fall into the pit.”

    The Jehovah’s Witnesses also attempt to shoehorn the general resurrection into the thousand year reign, which would enable the generally resurrected to be judged then during the so-called second judgment day period, teaching that the one sitting on the white throne judges during the thousand year reign and not after. But this is also a false interpretation.

    Also, there are many "unrighteous" persons buried in Sheol (Hades), mankind's common grave, or in the "sea," watery graves. The judgment of these along with "the righteous" resurrected on earth is described in Revelation 20:12, 13; "And I saw the dead, the great and the small, standing before the throne, and scrolls were opened. But another scroll was opened; it is the scroll of life. And the dead were judged out of those things written in the scrolls according to their deeds. And the sea gave up those dead in it, and death and Hades gave up those dead in it, and death and Hades gave up those dead in them, and they were judged individually according to their deeds.

    Time of the earthly resurrection. We note that this judgment is placed in the Bible in the account of events occurring during Christ's Thousand Year Reign with his associate kings and priests. These, the apostle Paul said, "will judge the world." (1Co 6:2) "The great and the small," persons from all walks of life, will be there to be judged impartially. (Insight, 788)

    However, Revelation 20:11 only refers to one throne, the white one, not multiple thrones, that is, the thrones of 20:5, 6 which the 144,000 allegedly occupy. This act of judgment from the white throne follows the thousand year reign; it is not during that reign, but after Satan’s release from prison, after the camp of the holy ones and the beloved city are surrounded, after the evil ones are consumed by fire, and after the Devil is thrown into the pool of fire and sulfur.

    7 Now as soon as the thousand years have been ended, Satan will be let loose out of his prison, 8 and he will go out to mislead those nations in the four corners of the earth, Gog and Ma´gog, to gather them together for the war. The number of these is as the sand of the sea. 9 And they advanced over the breadth of the earth and encircled the camp of the holy ones and the beloved city. But fire came down out of heaven and devoured them. 10 And the Devil who was misleading them was hurled into the lake of fire and sulphur, where both the wild beast and the false prophet [already were]; and they will be tormented day and night forever and ever.

    11 And I saw (“Next I saw” NAB; “Then I saw” RSV, TNIV, NIV, NASB, AB, WENT) a great white throne and the one seated on it. From before him the earth and the heaven fled away, and no place was found for them. 12 And I saw the dead, the great and the small, standing before the throne, and scrolls were opened. But another scroll was opened; it is the scroll of life. And the dead were judged out of those things written in the scrolls according to their deeds. 13 And the sea gave up those dead in it, and death and Ha´des gave up those dead in them, and they were judged individually according to their deeds. 14 And death and Ha´des were hurled into the lake of fire. This means the second death, the lake of fire. 15 Furthermore, whoever was not found written in the book of life was hurled into the lake of fire. (Rev. 20:7-15 NWT) (emphasis added)

    The Jehovah’s Witnesses’ theory creates a problem for themselves because moving the white throne judgment back into the thousand year reign means their ‘perfected’ man cannot be judged as they claim at the final test after the thousand year reign, a test by the way which is not mentioned at all in Revelation 20:9, but only assumed.

    9 And they advanced over the breadth of the earth and encircled the camp of the holy ones and the beloved city. But fire came down out of heaven and devoured them. (Rev. 20:9)

    All it says is that the camp and city of the holy ones become surrounded by Satan’s quislings Gog and Magog and their ilk who are then surreptitiously destroyed with no mention that the holy ones are subjected to yet another test. Remember, according to the Jehovah’s Witnesses this test is administered to Abraham, Moses and Isaiah, etc. who have been enlightened and lifted up to human perfection by the Great Crowd, and learn of Jesus, which is unlikely to say the least. (Moses? Of Matthew 17:3?). Although the Jehovah's Witnesses have been known to deny it, this really is "works-based" salvation.

    In the judgment scene at Revelation 20:11-15, during Christ's Millennial Reign "the scroll of life" is shown as opened to receive additional names; scrolls of instruction are also opened. Those who come back in the 'resurrection of the unrighteous' will thus have the opportunity of having their names written on "the scroll of life," provided they obediently perform deeds that are in harmony with the scrolls of instruction (Ac 24:15) Of course, faithful servants of God who come back in the resurrection of the righteous will already have their names in the "scroll of life." By their loyal obedience to the divine instructions, they will keep their names in it.

    How does a person get his name permanently retained in the "book of life"? For those who are in line to receive heavenly life, it is by conquering this world through faith, proving themselves faithful even to death." Re 2:10; 3:5 For those who are in line to receive life on earth, it is by proving loyal to Jehovah through a final, decisive test at the end of Christ's Millennial Reign. (Re 20:7, 8) Those who maintain integrity through that final test will have their names retained permanently by God in the "book of life." (Insight, 251)

    The Jehovah's Witnesses are cautioned to read Ephesians 2:8,9: "For by grace you have been saved through faith, and this is not from you; it is the gift of God; it is not from works so no one may boast." Furthermore, a final test is not necessary by the Jehovah’s Witnesses’ own admission since they also state that the issue pertaining to man’s obedience has been already settled, that the issue of God’s sovereignty “has been judicially settled by the court of heaven,”(Insight, 170). But if that is the case there would be no reason to keep putting ‘perfected’ man on judgment.

    In the end, the so-called 1918 first resurrection of the 144,000 must be moved forward near the inception or into the thousand year reign because it can’t stay where it is and has no other place to go since the first resurrection can’t take place after the thousand year reign because they flatly reject that option (Reasoning, 338). Consequently, the Jehovah’s Witnesses are stuck in a conundrum or two, another vexing set of problems:

    (1) The resurrected 144,000 are merged with the resurrected members of the Great Crowd and the unrighteous during the thousand year reign, all of whom are therefore part of the first resurrection. But since those of the first resurrection, which would actually be the general resurrection, do not die again in the Second Death (Rev. 20:6), educating them to perfection and putting them on judgment would be pointless.

    (2) If returning the 144,000’s first resurrection to the thousand year reign shifts, or bumps, the generally resurrected to after the thousand year reign, there is no one to educate to perfection and put on judgment during the millennial period.

  • JWoods
    JWoods

    Well, thanks Jonathan.

    That was about as clear as mud - makes no more sense to me than the Watchtower issues blondie found on it.

  • EverAStudent
    EverAStudent

    " *** w60 8/1 p. 462 'Creating New Heavens and a New Earth' *** In a time parallel, Jesus Christ was enthroned as King in heaven A.D. 1914. "

    lol :)

    Therefore Pilate said to Him, "So You are a king?" Jesus answered, "You say correctly that I am a king. For this I have been born, and for this I have come into the world, to testify to the truth. Everyone who is of the truth hears My voice."(John 18:37)

    Seems Jesus thought He was a king long before 1914...

    "And so, because [David] was a prophet and knew that GOD HAD SWORN TO HIM WITH AN OATH TO SEAT one OF HIS DESCENDANTS ON HIS THRONE, he looked ahead and spoke of the resurrection of the Christ, that HE WAS NEITHER ABANDONED TO HADES, NOR DID His flesh SUFFER DECAY." (Acts 2:30-31)

    Seems the prophet David thought the Christ would be enthroned as a king on the day of His resurrection...

    1914...rofl

  • EverAStudent
    EverAStudent

    hmmmm....I wonder what you would call a king who rules over all other kings????

    and from Jesus Christ, the faithful witness, the firstborn of the dead, and the ruler of the kings of the earth. To Him who loves us and released us from our sins by His blood-- (Revelation 1:5)

    Oh, I know! The King of Kings!!!! Since 33 A.D.

  • ThomasCovenant
    ThomasCovenant

    Thanks for replying. I found this.

    'You Can Live Forever in Paradise on Earth page 173 para 22 says,

    ''They are the remaining ones, a remnant of the 144,000. When are they resurrected? They do not need to sleep in death, but they are raised immediately when they die.''

  • blondie
    blondie

    But only since 1918 per the WTS.

  • cameo-d
    cameo-d

    WT: " Three and a half years later, in the spring of 33 C.E., he was resurrected as a mighty spirit person"

    Is WT saying that it took 3 1/2 years before Jesus resurrected?

    WT:"Therefore, anointed Christians who died before Christ’s presence were raised to heavenly life ahead of those who were still alive during Christ’s presence."

    How could there be any "christians" before christ existed for them to be called by his name?

  • blondie
    blondie

    1) *** w07 1/1 p. 28 par. 12 "The First Resurrection"—Now Under Way ***Jesus Christ was anointed as the future King of God’s Kingdom in the fall of 29 C.E. Three and a half years later, in the spring of 33 C.E., he was resurrected as a mighty spirit person

    The reference is not that he had been dead for 3 1/2 years, but that after 3/12 years from 29 CE to 33 CE (3 1/2 years) he died and was resurrected. The WTS says some wild things but not this time.

    2) Bad grammar I suppose; but they are referring to Christ's presence being in 1914 (1874 prior) so referring to all Christians who died between 33 CE and 1918.

  • JWoods
    JWoods

    Once again I am amazed by the arrogance of this JW doctrine - it effectively denies the resurrection of any christian down through the centuries until their own self-appointed date of 1918.

    A date that they themselves printed "cannot be directly confirmed in the bible".

    It is all about JW dates and chronology - everything is all about that. And yet, the expected results did not happen on those dates. We are expected to believe that anything that did happen was later discovered to be invisible and hidden.

    But still they are "right" on the dates.

  • Chalam
    Chalam

    *** w07 1/1 p. 28 par. 12 "The First Resurrection"—Now Under Way ***J

    Some things never change :(

    2 Timothy 2:17-18 (New International Version)

    17 Their teaching will spread like gangrene. Among them are Hymenaeus and Philetus, 18 who have wandered away from the truth. They say that the resurrection has already taken place, and they destroy the faith of some.

    A similar lie as the WT proclaiming Jesus returned in 1914 :(

    2 Thessalonians 2:1-4 (New International Version)

    1 Concerning the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our being gathered to him, we ask you, brothers, 2 not to become easily unsettled or alarmed by some prophecy, report or letter supposed to have come from us, saying that the day of the Lord has already come. 3 Don't let anyone deceive you in any way, for (that day will not come) until the rebellion occurs and the man of lawlessness is revealed, the man doomed to destruction. 4 He will oppose and will exalt himself over everything that is called God or is worshiped, so that he sets himself up in God's temple, proclaiming himself to be God.

    Blessings,

    Stephen

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