Yesterday's Watchtower Study

by RunningMan 19 Replies latest jw friends

  • teejay
    teejay

    Between,

    Check the bio in my profile. I know about dub-ism very, very well.

    Your "I can't believe..." comment made me think that you'd never been a JW. Having been one, then you know why and how that happens. How did it happen to you? Or me? Why was I a 'believer' well into my thirties, never willing to give all that I'd been taught a moments thought? Answer those questions, and you'll know how it it's happening to 6 million dubs right now.

    I'll never be an active Witness again. Still, I harbor no animosity against the people who are still there and won't call down evil on them. As far as I'm concerned, many of them are truly victims, walking dead. On the other hand, some are like my mother – people who have found exactly what they have been looking for. Either way, for whatever reason, all of them are there because they want to be.

    When they start to doubt, when the rules become too much, they'll start to look for the exit. Folks like you and me will be out here, helping them find their way to freedom.

    Peace,
    tj

  • betweenworlds
    betweenworlds

    Hey Tee,

    I know, poor choice of words on my part. (sigh) I'm forever sticking my foot in my mouth

    I'm just so amazed that I was duped for so very long! I should have said we, not they. (writing on chalkboard 1000 times "think before you write")

    I too do not harbour animosity. I think more apt desciptive words for the way I feel would be frustration and sadness. I hope that someday my mom, dad and brother will be able to break free. I have discussed some of my feelings with my mom, who had serious doubts in the early 80s, but eventually went back (unfortunately) I think she deep down knows that it's not *the truth* but is truly scared to face the reality of that fact. Her and my dad rarely if ever go to the meetings anymore, so maybe there is hope I haven't even broached the subject with my husbands mom and dad. They are REALLY still into *the truth* in a huge way. But like you say we'll be here to help if they ever do come to the realization that what we were taught for so very many years aren't true.

    Thanks

    between

    Everything secret degenerates, even the administration of justice; nothing is safe that does not show how it can bear discussion and publicity. Lord Acton 1834-1902

  • cyberguy
    cyberguy

    Hi RunningMan!

    The last meaningful reference that I could find on this scripture was
    from the 1975 WT. At that time, the application was that this
    referred to those killed at Armageddon.
    In the '75 WT, I believe they primarliy made a spiritual application to those slain. I remembered this article when we covered it in the KH many moons ago! See the following:

    *** w74 12/15 757-8 Standing Untouched, as Thousands Fall Victims ***

    26 Those spoken of as being at the “very side” of these dedicated worshipers of Jehovah God would be the people of Christendom and Jewry who profess to worship the God of the Holy Bible. They “fall” in spiritual death because they are not in Jehovah’s place of spiritual security. Hence, they are exposed to the spiritually death-dealing things described by the psalmist, the dreadful thing of earth’s night, the flying arrow of the day, the gloom-infesting pestilence, the “destruction that despoils at midday.” They have not really made God their strong “refuge.”

    27 As if a thousand to one were not a big enough contrast, the psalmist says that those falling will be “ten thousand at your right hand.” As in the case of the Almighty God, the “right hand” is pictorial of the hand and side that is the stronger. (Ps. 98:1) So those to whom we have had to offer the stronger spiritual resistance because of their greater religious strength fall victim because they are not proof against worldliness, modernism, antireligious propaganda, popular theology and demon-inspired religious doctrines and practices. They are not immunized by the help of God’s spirit.

    28 Today, when we contrast the reported number of the anointed remnant of spiritual Israel, around ten thousand, with the thousands of millions of members of religious Babylon the Great, we can see it to be literally true that ten thousand have fallen at the right hand of this remnant of the “seed” of God’s “woman.” (Rev. 12:17) But in place of those tens of thousands that have fallen in spiritual death at the right hand of this remnant, Jehovah God has raised up a “great crowd” of sheeplike believers who have dedicated their lives to Jehovah God through Jesus Christ the Fine Shepherd. (Rev. 7:9-17; John 10:16; Matt. 25:31-46) Jehovah has been raising these up as companions of the remnant notably since the year 1935. Today they number into the hundreds of thousands, so that Jehovah’s Christian witnesses now number close onto two million who proclaim God’s kingdom.

    29 To those who have fallen spiritually the destructive, faith-ruining agency from worldly sources has come near. But to those standing in God’s place of spiritual security, “to you it will not come near.” Since the postwar year of 1919 C.E., the remnant have accepted the spiritual healing provided by the Great Physician, Jehovah God. (Ps. 103:1-3) But not so Christendom, as foretold in Isaiah 6:9-12; Matthew 13:14, 15. Consequently, Christendom’s more than a thousand million members succumb to the spiritually ruinous influences and pressures of this disease-ridden world. But God has immunized his remnant and the “great crowd” of their Christian companions. To their place of spiritual immunity God does not let the worldly contagion draw near. Their obediently staying in God’s “secret place” keeps them safe, well.

    30 After many years now of trustfully dwelling “in the secret place of the Most High,” the anointed remnant of spiritual Israel and, latterly, the “great crowd” of their fellow witnesses have observed the truthfulness of what the inspired psalmist next says: “Only with your eyes will you look on and see the retribution itself of the wicked ones.”—Ps. 91:8.

    31 It is evident that here the Most High God does not class those in His “secret place” with the “wicked,” who are outside and who are part of this wicked world. Now especially, toward the end of this doomed system of things, those who have been indulging in the ways of this wicked world are eating the fruitage of their course as a retribution. Due requital is coming upon the worldlings as their problems multiply in political, commercial, moral, social and religious affairs. As they sowed, they are reaping. Modern society, which has become very permissive of the so-called “new morality,” the “sex revolution,” cannot immunize the sex perverts from “receiving in themselves the full recompense, which was due for their error.”—Rom. 1:27; Luke 21:25, 26.

    32 The worldly-wise are falling victims to their own schemes. Those who have rejected the wisdom of God’s Word and left themselves open to Satan’s machinations have become the dupes of “every unrighteous deception for those who are perishing, as a retribution because they did not accept the love of the truth that they might be saved.” (2 Thess. 2:9, 10) Already, before the approaching “great tribulation,” Jehovah’s safeguarded ones are looking on and seeing with their eyes the difference, as regards consequences, “between a righteous one and a wicked one, between one serving God and one who has not served him.”—Mal. 3:18.

  • dungbeetle
    dungbeetle

    I counted something like five references to the 'anointed remnant and their faithful companions' and was thinking that they really are going to shove the dual class system down our throats for the rest of the year.

    and in the comments, at least three times the statement was made "Satan relly wants to kill the anointed who are already in heaven, but since he can't he is after the anointed remnant here on earth."

    so then the comments when on, like the article, about persecution and how no matter what t hey do to us we won't stop preaching, even if they imprison and kill us blah blah blah...

    and I got to thinking, 'persecution'? PERSECUTION? The watchtower is the second largest printing company in the WORLD or something like that, with a billion pieces of literature a year...and I don't think one Witness at this study took public transportation, they all have cars....what persecution...WTF? As for the other countries where "they're trying to stop our work, stop our message..." HUH? France wants you to pay taxes, Bulgaria wants you to stop killing children, Russia doesn't want you to own land....what's this got to do with preaching the good news.

    And maybe you shouldn't go around calling people 'bird food'...

    idiots!!!!

    In 1975 a crack team of publishers was sentenced to death by a judicial commiteee. They promptly escaped from the cult and now live life on the run. If you have a problem ... and if you can find them ... maybe you can contact the A--postate Team"

  • RunningMan
    RunningMan

    Thanks for the reference, Betweenworlds. There are a couple of other
    articles in the mid-seventies. I am certain that one of them refers to
    literal deaths at Armagedon. I will check the specific one that I had
    in mind and post it (unfortunately, not until Wed).

    In the meantime, I notice that the 1975 article referred to those of
    "Christendom and Jewry". Yesterday's article refers to JW's who
    defect. So, we now have three interpretations of this scripture.

  • betweenworlds
    betweenworlds

    Think cyberguy gets the thanks for that article

    bw (who wishes she would provide something useful for a change)

    Everything secret degenerates, even the administration of justice; nothing is safe that does not show how it can bear discussion and publicity. Lord Acton 1834-1902

  • RunningMan
    RunningMan

    Here is the (much delayed) reference for the literal interpretation
    of Psalm 91:7,8

    God's Kingdom of 1000 years has approached, p 155

    WT March 15, 1974, p 172

  • Will Power
    Will Power

    GOD'S KINGDOM OF A THOUSAND YEARS HAS APPROACHED.
    pg 155
    20 Lodging "under the very shadow of the Almighty One," those who keep allegiance to Jehovah's universal sovereignty will, only with their eyes, "look on and see the retribution itself of the wicked ones." (Psalm 91:1, 8)
    They will behold the fulfillment of what was foretold in Rev 20:9 regarding the post-millennial "Gog & Magog": "And they advanced over the breadth of the earth and encircled the camp of the holy ones and the beloved city. But fire came down out of heaven and devoured them." These disloyal ones of mankind get a baptism of fire, which means their everlasting destruction. God does not justify them or declare them righteous and enter their names on the "book of life." (rom 8:33) This is no abuse of Jehovah's universal sovereignty but is a rightful expression of it toward his enemies.

    New thread with question about the next paragraph in this beloved book regarding Christ as the Abaddon. Any thoughts, comments?
    great bedtime reading for the kids! by the way)

  • julien
    julien
    and in the comments, at least three times the statement was made "Satan relly wants to kill the anointed who are already in heaven, but since he can't he is after the anointed remnant here on earth."

    Yet another example of the JWs poorly conceived and primitive (actually, inherited from primitives) ideas about Satan. The notion that any of these spirit beings, if they existed, would give a rat's ass about any of us humans is ridiculous. Why would Satan want to go after the remnant on earth? Killing them just results in them going to heaven. Persecution just results in strengthening of their resolve -- it doesn't work. JWs (and other fundies) have this picture of these super powerful beings, but they all act like a bunch of petty ignorant humans. Same with ideas like worship and animal sacrifice from the OT.. Some human despot may want those things, but I seriously doubt that any being powerful and advanced enough to create the universe would.

  • dungbeetle
    dungbeetle

    Heehee..good point Julien!!!

    In 1975 a crack team of publishers was sentenced to death by a judicial commiteee. They promptly escaped from the cult and now live life on the run. If you have a problem ... and if you can find them ... maybe you can contact the A--postate Team"

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