"While the Bridegroom was delaying..."

by Yadirf 13 Replies latest jw friends

  • Yadirf
    Yadirf

    “While the Bridegroom was delaying, they all nodded and went to sleep”
    Matthew 25:5

    I actually posted this earlier this evening, but after only 2 replies and about 15 reads the contents of the entire thread disappeared for some reason. So I'm reposting it under a slightly adjusted title.

    In Amazing’s thread (entitled “2001 vs 1975” http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/forum/thread.asp?id=17409&site=3) I found Erich’s reply to Simon especially interesting and insightful. I pulled it out of that thread in order to make a different topic out of it for what I think to be obvious reasons.

    This is the comment and its reply that forms the basis for my thread here:

    I think everyone is getting tired. (by Simon)
    There you are !!!

    See Matt. 25:5 .
    "While the bridegroom was delaying, they all nodded and went to sleep".
    Note: ALL of the "virgins"... (by Erich)

    I believe that Erich made a very good point. I think that at this period in the history of the WTS that in some respects it's indeed in somewhat of a quandary, that is, a state of uncertainty or perplexity … and, that this is what was foretold even. I don’t mean that in a negative way at all, as many here who know my position can testify to, but I’m merely trying to diagnose the situation at hand in the light of the Bible and my personal experience with them both. The fact is, that just like Christendom, the WTS has anticipated the end of man’s system now for a long time. At first 1914, and it didn’t come. Then the brother’s looked forward to 1925 with the same hopes, but it didn’t happen then either. Then we had hopes of it happening in the mid-seventies, and yet it didn’t then EITHER. And it STILL hasn’t come about … even in spite of the fact that its now been a full 87 years since 1914 (the date assumed for Jesus having received the crown and along with it the start of time of the end). And yet it still SEEMS to the WTS, that exactly what Jesus had foretold at Matthew 24:7 surely has come to pass. But the end JUST KEEPS ON DELAYING! Why???!!! Of all things, in its eyes, that must be the single most perplexing big question facing the WTS right now in the year 2001. In the meantime the WTS has blown the end out of the “generation” of 1914, due to the reason that a literal generation has passed since that year without the end having came.

    Understandably, before yet comprehending that it’s a MISTAKEN belief in the first place to have assumed that Matthew 24:7 has already undergone fulfillment, there’s nothing left to do BUT be perplexed. Hence an inducement towards drowsiness. So, like you suggested, Erich, this may be the very thing that Jesus pointed to in his parable of the “ten virgins”. Of course Christendom’s churches have been saying for a long time too now that Jesus could come “at any moment”, and that “no other prophecies are left to be fulfilled”. So now, it appears, is the perfect time to expect that ALL the “virgins” (those who hope to rule with Christ) will be nodding off to sleep … with Jesus’ seeming delay providing the inducement to do so.

    Until the present day and time, at no other time in the history of Christianity has all the pieces been in place in order to make it feasible for Jesus parable to truly find application. For example: It of course would be essential that the foretold 7th King make the scene first. Not only has THAT been realized, but there has been talk for years now of the creation of a global government; which upon being realized will fulfill the role of the 8th King of Bible prophecy. But before such an 8th King could be realized the 7th had to arise first (which is, btw, not the USA &GB), because the birth of the 8th depends upon the existence of the 7th … being that it “springs” from the 7th (one of “the seven”). So before the bridegroom arrives, and the “discreet” virgins are escorted into the marriage feast, even the 8th King has to be in place. Hence, it was impossible for Jesus’ parable to find application at anytime during the intervening centuries between the birth of Christianity and our day.

    So while in sort of a “sleep”, because of not quite knowing what to make out of Jesus’ seeming delay, the WTS has the opportunity to reconsider its perception of the Bible with regards to certain doctrines … not the least of which by far is the one having to do with 1914, currently still believed as being taught in Daniel chapter 4. Now is the time for the WTS to appreciate the wisdom of Matthew 13:51-52, the reading of which I will quote here:

    "Did you get the sense of all these things?" They said to him: "Yes." Then he said to them: "That being the case, every public instructor, when taught respecting the kingdom of the heavens, is like a man, a householder, who brings out of his treasure store things new and old."
    I deal with that passage and my concept of its meaning here---> http://4heavens.homestead.com/9.html

    Of course the existing situation fits in all too well with an especially important prophecy as found at Daniel 11:35; a prophecy that to date has been misapplied by the WTS but nevertheless SPECIFICALLY addresses the big question of whether or not the “time of the end” has truly been in progress as claimed, and proclaimed around the world by the members of my particular faith ---> Jehovah’s Witnesses. O how relevant such a prophecy is to the Organization of Jehovah’s Witnesses! Particularly so in view of the fact that the WTS has believed and taught as being factual that the “time of the end” has now been in progress for over 87 years, beginning on a date which is derived from a faulty interpretation of Daniel 4.

    So, once the WTS has corrected its doctrinal errors then the true time of the end can begin … since according to Daniel 11:35 that’s presently what is holding things up. Once the WTS has done that then God will trigger the one thing that leads to the events of Matthew 24:7 ACTUALLY unfolding. That “one thing” of course is the unleashing of his Son Michael (Jesus) upon Satan and his demon followers, ousting them from heaven. The “nation against nation and kingdom against kingdom” mentioned in Jesus’ prophecy will be as a direct result of Satan’s being confined to earth’s vicinity. In his frenzy to thwart God’s advancing purpose of having Michael shortly thereafter assume the reins-of-rulership over the earth, Satan, out of sheer desperation will stir up the nations in warfare with such intensity that the survival of the human race itself will be in question. (See Matthew 24:21, 22.)

    The consequence: The complete collapse of the entire global system of things. This is pictured by the 7th head of the beast of Revelation 13 receiving its “death-stroke”, aka “sword-stroke”. But that is NOT Armageddon, as, at that point in time, it itself is yet a few years away. At THAT point and time the 8th King will have not yet made the scene. But once the governments get back upon their feet (as symbolized by the beast’s head healing of its death stroke) then figuring out a way to prevent what they had just went through from ever happening again will be at the top of their agenda, their very top priority. Yes, the nations will never EVER want to re-experience the calamitous woes that they will have just gone through, which, according to Satan’s design/intention, had indeed threatened even to exterminate mankind off the face of the earth. So, thinking that a one-world government (a global government; aka 8th King), to be the surefire solution for preventing a repeat performance of what the nations will have just gone through, the nations of earth will at that time, and with the greatest of seriousness and eagerness, entertain the “one thought” of concocting such a World Government. (Revelation 17:13, 17) Their “one thought” really means that they are in agreement with one another in what is considered to be needed in order to avoid any like catastrophe in the future, and to once and for all time secure “peace and security” for the planet upon which they must live. Such is not to say that the idea of a global government will not have been tossed around before, because it most assuredly has been, for several years now even. It’s just that nothing even remotely bordering on being as serious as what will happen at that future time will have ever happened prior to then so as to get the attention of all nations in a way that it will then at such a unique, cataclysmic time.

    We are indeed approaching what will surely prove to be some very momentous times, first with the WTS refining its doctrines in fulfillment of Daniel 11:35; then with regards to the events that God will trigger after that happens, and which will finally lead to Armageddon. Armageddon’s purpose, of course, is to cleanse the earth of all who would commit idolatry by having accepted the “mark” of allegiance to the World Government, in place at that time. Because to receive the mark is tantamount to idolatry, in other words the WORSHIP of an idol, it’s for this reason that Revelation 14:7 with such relevance says:

    ”Fear God and give him glory, because the hour of the judgment by him has arrived, and so worship the One who made the heaven and the earth and sea and fountains of waters.”
    Yadirf

    Here are a few links having to do with global government:
    ---> http://www.wfm.org/congress/index.html
    ---> http://www.wfa.org/about/
    ---> http://www.wfa.org/index.html
    ---> http://www.upf.org/whatis/worfed.htm
    ---> http://www.worldfederalist.org/
    ---> http://www.star.ucl.ac.uk/~iac/fed.html
    ---> http://www.capitalresearch.org/fw/fw-0201a.htm
    ---> http://www.wfa.org/field/thoughts.html

    All the above were found here, plus more:
    ---> http://auto.search.msn.com/results.asp?cfg=SMCINITIAL&srch=5&FORM=AS5&RS=CHECKED&v=1&q=World+Federalism

    For your observation:

    By Elizabeth A. Wood, WFA member.
    Some national anthems are war-like. The U.S. national anthem speaks of "bombs bursting in air." The French national anthem urges the citizens "to arms." We need an international anthem that speaks of peace and togetherness. This International Anthem is sung to the tune of "My Country 'Tis of Thee" (a.k.a. "America" and "God Save the Queen/King").

    An International Anthem
    In peace we are as one.
    We share one moon, one sun.
    We share the stars.

    Our joys, our laughs and tears,
    Our confidence and fears,
    Our hope we share for future years,
    This one world is ours.


    Daniel 11:35 ... a KEY prophecy that must be fulfilled before the "time of the end" gets underway.

  • aChristian
    aChristian

    Friday,

    The JW religion is now and always has been nothing more than an insignificant, third rate, cult. If you really believe it has some special place in Bible prophecy you are nuttier than your buddy You Know. You say that, "once the WTS has corrected its doctrinal errors then the true time of the end can begin." You might as well say that, "once the WTS has emptied the Pacific Ocean with a teaspoon then the true time of the end can begin." Such a task would be easier and could be done in less time.

  • kevin221
    kevin221

    YAWN

  • Yadirf
    Yadirf

    aChristianWeed

    The reaction that I’ve gotten out of you in what I’ve posted here, equates with the reaction that Truth Bearer’s have always experienced from those who just can’t “hear” the truth … due to the noise that their ears are exposed to each Sunday.

    Christendom is now and always has been nothing more than the "weeds" of Jesus parable at Matthew 13:25 & 30. If you really believe that Christendom has some special place in Bible prophecy you are nuttier than your buddy Whoever. In view of Daniel 11:35 the WTS can be expected to refine each and every doctrine that's in need of refinement, but the world of Christendom ... that's an entirely different situation. For example, after all the centuries that have passed, for the most part Christendom STILL preaches that man has an immortal soul, in some cases that "hell" is literally hot, and that everyone "saved" will live in "heaven" with God himself … which leaves the earth doing what?

    To expect Christendom to actually proceed with making changes in its false doctrines, doctrines which she has preached for centuries upon centuries, is like trying to imagine the Pacific Ocean being dipped dry with a mere teaspoon while all the while a relentless thunderstorm keeps adding more water than is being taken out. Such a way of trying to dry up an Ocean would be easier to do and could be done in less time than what it would take Christendom to change her viewpoints having to do with the most basic doctrines of the Bible. Such is absolutely proven by the enormous amount of time that has ALREADY passed since Christendom’s founding, while she sits idly by merely twiddling her thumbs.

    Thanks for being so nice, Weed.

    Yadirf

    Daniel 11:35 ... a KEY prophecy that must be fulfilled before the "time of the end" gets underway.

  • kevin221
    kevin221

    DOUBLE YAWN!

  • Naeblis
    Naeblis

    Looks like Friday is joining some interesting company.

    999 - Pope Sylvester announces the second coming of Christ. Christians give their possessions to the Church, travel to holy places and burn people who might be witches.
    1534 - Anabaptists in Münster, Germany declare the second coming is at hand and barricade themselves in. They fall from puritanism to sexual permissiveness and are eventually starved out. Their leaders are killed.

    1736 - Followers of a man called Whiston rush to Hampstead to watch the destruction of London as a curtain raiser before the world ends.

    1843 - American farmer William Miller predicts the end of the world will fall on 21 March. So-called 'Millerites' gather on hilltops to greet Christ and the angels. Needless to say, it does not happen. He checks his figures and announces that it is still on, this time for 22 October 1844. This becomes known as "the Great Disappointment" when the apocalypse fails to materialise.

    1914 - One of the years chosen for Armageddon by the Jehovah's Witnesses. When that passed they tried 1918, 1925....then 1975. Then they gave up the end-of-the-world prediction business.

    1919 - Albert Porta, a weatherman in the US, predicts that the Sun will explode and take the Earth with it.

    1955 - Prophet Marian Keetch warns of massive floods - a revelation allowed to her by her contact with aliens. When it does not happen she claims they were averted by the power of prayer.

    1967 - The Six Day War in the Middle East is expected by some fundamentalist Christians to trigger the "Rapture", when the just are supposed the be raised to Heaven before the world ends.

    1969 - According to Charles Manson, the Four Horsemen of the Apocalypse, otherwise known as the Beatles, were supposed to bring about Armageddon with their song "Helter Skelter".

    1987 - Dr Jose Arguelles predicts the end is nigh on August 16, due to the alignment of the planets. This was supposed to cause a galactic beam to hit the Earth, with the usual consequences.

    1988 - Nasa scientist Edgar Whisenaut predicts the Rapture will take place in 1988 and makes a lot of money selling books about it.

    Meanwhile, Charles Taylor, a "prophecy teacher" in the US who also predicted the end for that year, arranged tours of the Holy Land, including "return if necessary".

    1992 - Korea. Pastor Lee Jang Rim predicts the Rapture for October. When it fails to take place, some of his followers kill themselves.

    1993 - Marie Devi Khristo of the White Brotherhood in the Ukraine predicts the world will end at midday on the 14 November....then tries again nine days later.

    1995 - The Branch Davidian cult leader David Koresh predicted the end of the world would happen in 1995. In the event, he and many other followers died following the siege at Waco, Texas in 1993.

    1997 - Self-professed Son of God and TV sports presenter David Icke decides the world will end in 1997, following the usual earthquakes and floods.

    This was also the year that many members of the Heaven's Gate cult committed suicide. They believed that the Hale-Bopp comet heralded the apocalypse and they thought that this was the only way they could join an alien spacecraft which they thought was travelling in the comet's wake.

    Magician Aleister Crowley also decided that "a devastating world war" would finish us off that year.

    1999 - Nostradamus predicted the end for July. Maybe he meant September...

  • aChristian
    aChristian

    Friday,

    You wrote: In view of Daniel 11:35 the WTS can be expected to refine each and every doctrine that's in need of refinement.

    Gee, I don't see the WTS mentioned anywhere in that verse. Maybe I should use the New World Translation.

    By the way, I don't promote "Christendom" or any Church group therein. I agree with you. Christendom is largely a field of weeds. And the WTS is one of the nastiest weeds in the field.

    The thing you need to realize, Friday, is that Christianity is not about what sect you belong to. It's about who you belong to. Instead of helping people come to understand that fact, many sects actually end up putting themselves between people and Christ. And the WTS probably does this more effectively, and almost certainly more intentionally, than most other sects in Christendom. Instead of directing people to Jesus Christ, they constantly direct people to themselves, crying, "Look at us. Listen to us. Follow us. Obey us. We are Christ's Faithful Slave. We are the way. We are the Truth. You will be judged on the basis of how you treated us. Come to us for salvation."

    Wake up, Friday. You are living in a dream world. Much like the Christian Scientists, the Moonies, the Mormons, and a few other such groups, The JW organization is simply one more Christ dishonoring cult that has never been approved of by God and never will be. The changes the WTS would have to make to turn itself into a truly Christian organization would not change the WTS, they would destroy it.

  • Yadirf
    Yadirf

    Weed-aka-aChristian (giggle)

    You know what's so funny, Weed? It's that for everything you say I can see it as applying to YOU. No joke! It's so very clear to me, you supply some of the most self-condemning expressions that I've ever witnessed in all my days.

    You say that you don't "see" the WTS mentioned in "that verse". Of course you don't, do you imagine that I figured that YOU would be able to discern such a thing. Of course not, Weed. I knew in advance of posting all of this that you haven't the insight that it takes to understand hardly ANYTHING about the Bible. Why are you that way? Because you're not in association with the right group, for only one reason.

    I'll let you in on a little secret, aChristian: Although I really do take pleasure in you reading my threads, and for that matter even getting things off your chest by squating inside here, but the real truth of the matter is that I had a broader audience in mind than the few that are registered to post on this forum. Wow, there must be gobs and gobs of people out there lurking that read posts such as this one that I've made. And of course I'm hoping that there's at least a few of those that can relate to what I've said. I'd be tremendously overjoyed if I knew that to be the case, because the Bible being such a precious thing I want other people to know about it and its proper meaning.

    So you just go on, aChristian (giggle), and make as many entries as you wish because you're merely a being a witness against yourself for those unseen thousands that are lurking and have just a little discernment.

    Yadirf

    Daniel 11:35 ... a KEY prophecy that must be fulfilled before the "time of the end" gets underway.

  • Undecided
    Undecided

    Hi Friday,

    Are you sure you are not Fred Franz resurrected?

    Ken P.

  • NeonMadman
    NeonMadman
    You say that you don't "see" the WTS mentioned in "that verse". Of course you don't, do you imagine that I figured that YOU would be able to discern such a thing. Of course not, Weed. I knew in advance of posting all of this that you haven't the insight that it takes to understand hardly ANYTHING about the Bible. Why are you that way? Because you're not in association with the right group, for only one reason.

    Right. So unless you are in association with the WTS, you won't have the discernment to see the WTS mentioned in the Bible. Undecided may be right; you do sound like Fred Franz. Possibly you could cite some unambiguous scriptures showing that one must associate with the right group in order to discern the meaning of scripture?

    I do believe there is one reference to the Watchtower and similar groups in scripture - I believe they are and always have been a big part of the 'foolish virgin' class, you know, the ones who ran out of 'oil' because the bridegroom had delayed his arrival? The wise virgins, of course, had heeded Jesus' words that 'no man knows the day and hour,' and remained prepared for his arrival at any time. The foolish virgins, on the other hand, had expected his arrival at a specific time of their determining, and were therefore nonplussed when he appeared to be 'delaying' his arrival. So, because they had focused on a man-made date, they ran out of oil and were taken by surprise when he arrived at a time they had not forseen. This, I believe, will be the fate of the Watchtower and similar 'false-prophet' groups.

    Tom
    "The truth was obscure, too profound and too pure; to live it you had to explode." ---Bob Dylan

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