No Bible = No God ???

by Sirona 30 Replies latest jw friends

  • Vinny

    I agree with your post to a degree Sirona. But I do not think such is the norm.

    I have also stated numerous times that even if the bible were just a book of stories and nothing more, that I personally still see powerfully conclusive reasons to believe that the universe, earth and all life upon it are the result of some Intelligent Designing Force, or God, rather than through unguided, random series of events.

    Some may believe if the bible is false then by default so is any kind of God. But most that reach the conclusion of being atheist, IMO, have done so for reasons other than just a lack of belief that the bible is inspired of God. Though I do not agree with those conclusions to be atheist, I can respect those reaching these conclusions especially if based on personal examinations.

    And still many others just give up worrying about it altogether and just life their life not believing either way.

    I have met all kinds on this site and in other places. There is no, "one size fits all" on this subject from my experience.

  • VoidEater

    For me, No Bible = Freedom to Find God.

    From my experiences, "God" is utterly unlike BibleGod (thanks, Dave aka AA). I like Carmel's "unknowable essence".

    The God I was raised with does not exist for me. The "God" I have found may be no more than fantasy, or no more than "natural phenomena".

    It's the little words that always pose the greatest difficulty in communication. What do you mean by "God"?

    Maybe I'm atheist because I don't believe in God. Maybe I'm a nutcase because I believe in things I cannot see (like electricity and strong attraction).

    Maybe I can start a cult - I believe in Gopher.

  • MMae

    I admire Native American spiritual beliefs. Of course these vary from culture to culture, but many have in common a firm belief in the union of Grandfather Sky and Grandmother Earth, as well as the Great Spirit. (A Holy Trinity, of sorts.) Interestingly they held beliefs that were often very similar to that of Christianity. Belief in an afterlife (The Great Hunting Ground.) Belief in a resurection, and a restoration (New Earth.) Some had prophecies of the End-of-Days, and great tribulation along with a judgement. They dreampt, saw visions, spoke with messengers. Being in touch with the spiritual realm was a given - a part of their everyday experience. Respect for the Earth, her eliments, and her fauna and flora was respect for God, the Great Creator. They had all this without a Bible. Their clarity of spiritual thought, and sense of right and wrong greatly outweighed that of an average Christian. They did not have a "guide book." Rather they had a personal relationship and accounting with God Himself.

    Note: I am NOT an expert on Native American belief systems. I am only relaying, to the best of my recollection, what I've read of NA culture and beliefs.

  • Sirona

    Some interesting points raised

    Mae - thanks for your info re Native Americans. This is the sort of thing I'm getting at. As a pagan (with some shamanistic leanings) I certainly don't find the need to look to the bible for information about god.


  • Xena

    Yea I've seen this as well, I think it's hard once you leave the JW's to grasp, initially anyway, there there is a god outside the bible. It also appears to be difficult to let go of the "false religion" mindset. By that I mean after leaving the dubs you still consider any other religion to be bad w/o actually learning about them or attending their services to see for yourself.

    For me it was babysteps...first letting go of the bible, then realizing there was a god and/or gods the might exist outside those parameters and then learning about and attending other religious services to let go of preconceived ideas about them. There is a great big wide world of interesting religions/faith based ideas and it's actually kinda fun to explore them. Expecially given the fact you don't have to embrace any of them fully this time around.

  • bavman

    Something has gotten on my nerves a bit recently. There are numerous discussions regarding the validity of the bible which usually result in the following:

    * An ExJW who has doubts about the bible concludes there is no god

    * An atheist points out the bible inconsistencies and as a result says its ridiculous to believe in a god.

    * A Christian who sees value in the bible asserts that the bible god is GOD (and none other)

    What bugs me is that everyone seems to ignore the fact that there are so many religions in the world who don't acknowledge the bible at all and the validity of the bible has NO bearing whatsoever on the question of whether a Deity or Deities exist.

    Too many "god doesn't exist" threads centre on the Christian view of God.

    I would expand this to say that not ALL 'Christians' view God in the same way. It seems to me most rejection of God is a rejection of the 'fundamentalist-type God'. I have fallen into this as well and I suppose you could call me an atheist in regard to a sky-daddy. However, I am coming into a type of belief of 'God' again which is a God that is harder to put a finger on. Something that trancends all 'masks' of God which man has created in his/her image.

    I believe the atheism that you see run rampant here is simply part of the process of growing spiritually for many. Many will reject the sky-daddy but ultimately return to a different type of spirituality. This spirituality will be much deeper and have a greater positive effect on their lives.

  • Undecided

    I wonder about his creation.

    Some would say his major talking is his creation.

    When I see the way tornators, volcanors and other natural disastors happen, plus viruses, germs and sicknesses, plus old age and death for all living things, I don't like a God like that who would create the universe as we know it. So I just sort of leave a God out of it.

    Ken P.

  • SickofLies

    I think you got it wrong, as an atheist I don't say that it is not possible that 'god' could exist, because no one can define what 'god' is. I merely assert that none of the worlds religions can possibly have an inspired account written by the creator of the universe.

  • real one
    real one

    you should be glad that you have the opportunity to be lead by the true God. those other religions are all doomed. Jehovah will make a mockery of all of them. if you study other religions you dont have to get deep into them to see they are all a crock

  • Narkissos

    Otoh we, including any "fresh ideas" we may have, are the product of a long and complex history, including ancient polytheism, Second-Temple Judaism, Graeco-Roman philosophy, ancient and middle-ages Christianity, Renaissance Humanism, Enlightenment Deism, etc. Even those streams of human tradition which might seem to be "independent" from this "mainstream" (from a Western perspective) have actually been confronted to it for centuries, and influenced by it (also by reacting to it). Iow, we (at least on this forum) are all dealing with the Christian heritage, either by interpreting it or rejecting it -- and in that sense, whether we label ourselves agnostic, atheist, pagan, buddhist, jew, moslem or christian, we are all primarily post-Christians (and, I would add in a slightly more inflammatory way, post-Christians playing agnostic, etc.). We have simply no way of receiving a "fresh religious message" without overloading it (even antagonistically) with the Christian cultural references we carry with ourselves.

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