What prompted the whopper of all Flip Flops? (Sodom & G. resurrection)

by Open mind 52 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • Leolaia
    Leolaia

    Wow, just a few months after that article, Rutherford did a complete about-face on the subject:

    *** w40 7/1 pp. 203-204 Escape From "Christendom's" Conflagration ***

    "Christendom" particularly is modern Sodom. We know that Sodom prophetically pictured Satan's organization on earth, and particularly that part called "Christendom", because it is written that, after the death of the Lord Jesus Christ, the witnesses of God on earth were killed by the beastly organization and their dead bodies lay in the street of "the great city, which spiritually is called Sodom ... where also our Lord was crucified". (Rev. 11:3-8) The inhabitants of Sodom were practitioners of the Devil religion and were exceedingly wicked...Until quite recently, God's faithful people on the earth understood that most of the peoples of the earth would pass through the great tribulation of the battle of Armageddon. This understanding corresponds with Abraham's expressed hope that the city, picturing "Christendom" down to the end of the world, would be saved because of some righteous ones there. But now it is seen that it is only those who seek Jehovah God and righteousness and meekness that have the promise of being "hid", spared and taken through Armageddon....Sodom is set forth as an example of those whom God will destroy at Armageddon....It is certain that the destruction of Sodom pictured Armageddon, and that Sodom particuarly foreshadowed that part of Satan's organization called "Christendom". Unfaithful Jerusalem also pictured "Christendom"....The conditions that obtained in and about Sodom exactly fit the conditions that now exist in "Christendom". Jesus, speaking of the conditions that would prevail upon earth at the time of his second coming, in glory as a divine spirit, likens such conditions unto those in ancient Sodom, thus further proving that the destruction of Sodom was a type or prophetic pattern and that it foreshadowed what shall come to pass upon "Christendom" at Armageddon....

    Lot and his family received the warning to flee, and they fled before destruction fell upon Sodom and Gomorrah. Likewise those who form the "great multitude" of persons of good will that will be "hid" during the battle of Armageddon receive the warning to flee, and they must flee to the Lord's Theocratic Government before Armageddon begins. Further, they must abide under the Lord's protection, seeking meekness and righteousness, until the fire of Armageddon has completely burned out; otherwise they will be destroyed together with "Christendom" and all the rest of Satan's organization. These things are recorded in the Bible as a pattern or guide for those who today undertake to serve the Lord now and for ever.

    I think this is the turning point, the "new light" article on the subject...notice the requisite "Until quite recently, God's faithful people on the earth understood that blah blah blah" statement. Now there is no distinction between Christendom and the "heathen", and thus Sodom can represent Christendom and both share the same kind of destruction.

  • Fatfreek
    Fatfreek

    Fatfreak...You have "1934" in that list where it should be "1939".

    Leolaia ... you have sharp eyes. Thanks.

    Len

  • Save My Soul
    Save My Soul
    So my question is, could anyone direct me to a thread that gives any kind of "insider" ideas as to what prompted such a series of stupidity?

    I attempted to answer the above by placing the YA quote on the board. I do not believe what was stated and find the reasoning very shallow that was used. The source that posted it, appears to be the organization, not a real person. It seems that the organization supports the flip flops with the faulty logic that I cut and pasted. It kinda like someone saying, "Sir, we must arrest you for cheating on your wife, 13 times". While the reply of the perpatrator is "You are a liar!!! I have not possibly, or maybe almost cheated more than 8 times. You are twisting the truth again you apostate u."

    Pretty weak argument the organization is using. I thought I was clear in prefacing my cut-and-paste.

    I am working 16 hour days, so I did not read many of the post relating to this subject, I barely perused through yours, and saw my name mentioned. I do NOT agree with the logic of the wtbts relating to Sodom.

  • Must obey!
    Must obey!

    Sheesh this is hardly the 'whopper' of all flip flops. Many of us 'apostates' are quite simply sensitised to over-exaggerating the Watchtower's cock-ups.

  • Open mind
    Open mind

    Sorry I couldn't come back to this thread until just now.

    Many thanks to Fat Freek, Leolaia, SaveMySoul & Kifoy for the research.

    And thanks to the others for your personal experiences.

    Must obey! said:

    "Sheesh this is hardly the 'whopper' of all flip flops."

    Well I can only come up with two criteria for a flip flop being a whopper. Substance & Quantity.

    1. Substance/importance: I stated in my original post that Organ Transplants are SUBSTANTIVELY way more important than the topic of this thread.

    2. Quantity of flip-flops. To my knowledge, this one is indeed the "whopper of all flip-flops" in terms of number of reversals. If I failed to make that clear in my original post, I apologize.

    Could you kindly direct my attention to the WT "flip-flop" that is MORE of a whopper than this one?

    OM

  • Fatfreek
    Fatfreek

    Save My Soul: I am working 16 hour days, so I did not read many of the post relating to this subject, I barely perused through yours, and saw my name mentioned. I do NOT agree with the logic of the wtbts relating to Sodom.

    I apologize for my criticism of your Yahoo copy and paste. I see now that you were merely sharing, not advocating, that information.

    Open Mind: Could you kindly direct my attention to the WT "flip-flop" that is MORE of a whopper than this one?

    Are you listening, Must Obey? We are waiting with a fresh batch of popcorn.

    Len

  • kifoy
    kifoy
    Leolaia:
    Well, yes and no.

    Thank you, Leolaia.

    I find it laborious to read through great amount of English text, so I might have missed some crucial details here and there. And those scans are not the most frendly to read either.

  • Open mind
    Open mind

    My reply to the faceless WT apologist who wrote the post on Yahoo! that SaveMySoul shared.

    Classic "try to have it both ways" thinking. So, if it's a "minor issue" and they can mess it up so many times, then I guess the Holy Spirit only actually gets involved when it's one of the "Big 3 or 4 or 5" (Hell, Trinity, Immortal Soul, Ransom, Preaching) major long-time WT doctrines. Otherwise, God lets stuff like the evils of Aluminum cookware, Vaccines & who lives in the Pleiades constellation slide through the Holy Spirit filtering mechanism.

    Interesting.

    So following this line of reasoning, as long a JW accepts the "Big 5" doctrines, then everything else is minor?

    Which is it? The Holy Spirit screws up repeatedly, or it knowingly allows the WT to mess up on "minor issues".

    BTW, lets not forget the new quote from the April 2008, Kool Aid edition of the WT, which puts the writings of the F&D Slave on virtually the same level as the Bible "by extension".

    OM

  • Fatfreek
    Fatfreek

    This is one of the best threads I've read in a long time. Thanks for starting it, Open Mind.

    If I had read something to the effect that the WT had completely reversed positions -- say, a third time, I say I would have been gone. That's easy for me to say now.

    In reality, however, when I was baptized in 1956, that's exactly what their box score was -- they were on their third position -- which was exactly the position that C.T. Russell had taken in the debut issue of today's Watchtower predecessor.

    By the time I made my exit in 1977 they were on their fifth postion on this teaching -- and I was too ignorant to be aware of that fact. Well, I like to excuse myself saying that there was no internet at that time. That's what it is, just an excuse. While there weren't a lot of resources back then, there were enough.

    Today, the Watchtower Society stands on their eighth position on the question, Will Those From Ancient Sodom and Gomorrah be resurrected? Lurkers and newbies, beware and take note. Bookmark this precious thread so you'll be able to someday make your own demonstration to someone you care about.

    Len Miller

  • tijkmo
    tijkmo
    Well I can only come up with two criteria for a flip flop being a whopper. Substance & Quantity.

    whats the scripture for that brother

Share this

Google+
Pinterest
Reddit