There have been a few posts lately on the board where people are giving their experiences in talking with JWs they meet in day to day life. This got me thinking of something I've never seen a post about on this board.
Because of a number of different factors it seems that JWs have a very unbalanced approach in the way they deal with criticism.
When the criticism is coming from a person outside of the group, the JW can sometimes show much more patience than they ever would with a fellow JW. Because they desire to give the best "witness" possible their guard is down. The JW may even give that person a little respect! This goes for ex-jws who do not reveal their past to a JW trying to talk with them. In fact, ex-jws (or well educated people in the subject) who know how to bring up the real hard hitting questions can sometimes really draw out the JW to realize he is clueless in regards to what he believes.
The opposite however is true when a JW criticizes the Watchtower in some form to another JW. Typically in these discussions the JW will really use some of the dirtiest and cheapest arguments in order to simply get their way. Sometimes even using blackmale (i.e. "i'll tell the elders on you if you don't stop this).
What do you think?
being an outsider as opposed to being an insider
by drew sagan 7 Replies latest watchtower beliefs
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drew sagan
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VoidEater
My dad was like that - I had to be perfect, while other kids could do whatever they wanted. I was supposed to be better than than them, and they were worldly and lost and couldn't be expected to be any better. I, on the other hand, had been taught better, knew better, so the rules were different. My cousins got more attention from my dad than I did, because I was expected to be stronger and better and less needy. Being "better" meant getting treated poorly.
The issue is one of "tribal membership" and acceptable behavior for the inside group versus outcasts.
Put a group of monkeys in a cage. Place a chair in the center. Above the chair put a banana so that the only way to get the banana is by standing on the chair.
Then, each time a monkey touches the chair, give the chair an electric shock. Soon all the monkeys know that you're not allowed to touch the chair. They stop touching the chair.
Then, take one monkey out and put a new monkey in. Watch the bahavior: the old monkeys will prevent the new monkey from touching the chair. Soon the new monkey knows that you're not allowed to touch the chair (though he only knows this because he's been "told" by the other monkeys). He stops touching the chair.
Do this for each of the original monkeys. Once the latest monkey has been conditioned to not touch the chair, swap out another old monkey.
Eventually you will have a group of monkeys that 1) have never been shocked personally, and 2) will prevent any new monkey from touching the chair.
So it is with the organization - all the monkeys will do their best to enforce accepted behaviors - and only because they are told to. The only twist is that all the inside monkeys have been told that "outside monkeys" are completely different animals (you are no part of the world, they are worldly, they are bad, you are good, they are lost, etc.) and therefore not deserving of "life saving" control. The inside monkeys are supposed to know better - and the inside monkeys will make sure that everyone else toes the line.
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sweet pea
You're spot on Drew.
It makes it frustrating for us, because we have no influence over former JW friends or Besty's family.
However, we can and do feed others with ammunition to draw Witnesses out and maybe <GASP> open their minds.
Following hearing my experience of being DF'd, an acquaintance told me about her subsequent conversation with a JW colleague. They discussed how cruel she thought shunning was just because one didn't believe identically anymore - the JW seemed almost delighted with the anticipation of it all. My friend is planning another session once I have primed her with more hotspots. <evil grin>
This is our ministry now..... :-) -
Frequent_Fader_Miles
When the criticism is coming from a person outside of the group, the JW can sometimes show much more patience than they ever would with a fellow JW. Because they desire to give the best "witness" possible their guard is down.
That's what I call "recruitment mode". Where's the wisdom in 'wasting' your patience on someone who's already inside?
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The Oracle
Voideater,
Your monkey post was spectacular!
That is a great analogy. Thanks!
The Oracle
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flipper
I think you are right ! This summer I had to pose as a " never " baptised unbelieving relative to anti-witness to an elder and his wife for 30 minutes at my doorstep! ! The elder did ask the question if I was a baptized witness and I just said , no, I just had relatives that were in it. No doubt that is why he let me go on at him and his wife about the child abuse scandal. He was trying to " help " me with my views . If he had known I was actually baptized he never would have given me the time ! So there you go, maybe we need to disguise ourselves and go incognito as a " worldy " person ! Infiltrate kingdom halls where they don't know us and start causing doubts in some as a secret agent man or something. Drew- you are starting to give old Mr. Flipper ideas ! Peace out, Mr. Flipper
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BBOARD
True ... and I just might do that!
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drew sagan
Great points VoidEater! I'm going to remember that illustration.