Canon: The chronology of the 70 years of desolation starting with the last deportation would be a separate 70 years.
Doug: That is pure invention. Besides, people continued to live on the lands of Judah and Israel.
This is not accurate. You suggest that I myself came up with the concept that the Jews who were last deported spent 70 years in "servitude" to Babylon before returning in the 1st of Cyrus. But I didn't. It's the Jewish traditional view found in Josephus! That is, the concept of who fulfilled Jereimah's prophecy of SERVITUDE (not desolation) of 70 years was the poor people deported at the last deportation. So when you come up with another interpretation of Jeremiah's prophecy about the 70 years of "servitude" you contradict secular Jewish history. Here's the quote:
Antiquities 10.9.7
which was the twenty-third of the reign of Nebuchadnezzar, he made an expedition against Celesyria; and when he had possessed himself of it, he made war against the Ammonites and Moabites; and when he had brought all these nations under subjection, he fell upon Egypt, in order to overthrow it; and he slew the king that then reigned (16) and set up another; and he took those Jews that were there captives, and led them away to Babylon. And such was the end of the nation of the Hebrews, as it hath been delivered down to us, it having twice gone beyond Euphrates; for the people of the ten tribes were carried out of Samaria by the Assyrians, in the days of king Hoshea; after which the people of the two tribes that remained after Jerusalem was taken [were carried away] by Nebuchadnezzar, the king of Babylon and Chaldea. Now as to Shalmanezer, he removed the Israelites out of their country, and placed therein the nation of the Cutheans, who had formerly belonged to the inner parts of Persia and Media, but were then called Samaritans, by taking the name of the country to which they were removed; but the king of Babylon, who brought out the two tribes, (17) placed no other nation in their country, by which means all Judea and Jerusalem, and the temple, continued to be a desert for seventy years; but the entire interval of time which passed from the captivity of the Israelites, to the carrying away of the two tribes, proved to be a hundred and thirty years, six months, and ten days.
Antiquities 11.1.1
1. IN the first year of the reign of Cyrus (1) which was the seventieth from the day that our people were removed out of their own land into Babylon, God commiserated the captivity and calamity of these poor people, according as he had foretold to them by Jeremiah the prophet, before the destruction of the city, that after they had served Nebuchadnezzar and his posterity, and after they had undergone that servitude seventy years, he would restore them again to the land of their fathers, and they should build their temple, and enjoy their ancient prosperity.
The above passages from Josephus shows that the Jews understood the interpretation of Jeremiah's prophecy about the seventy years of servitude began with the last deportation and this was the servitude of the "poor people" who had been left in the land after the fall of Jerusalem and who had ran down to Egypt. As noted above, these were deported in the 23rd year of Nebuchadnezzar. No "nations" are mentioned. So even if some nations served seventy years or more under Babylonian rule, as you say, it would be independent of the seventy years those who were last deported served.
So there is no reason for you to contradict me if I concede to your interpretation that Jeremiah might have implied the nations would serve 70 years under Babylon, since that would not necessarily interfere with the 70 years also served by those of the last deportation, even though Josephus does mention Jeremiah's prophecy here.
So another issue here is whether or not Jeremiah's interpretation of the 70 years coincides with (1) The Bible and/or (2) the WTS. In that regard, Josephus varies from the WTS who count 70 years from the fall of Jerusalem to the 1st of Cyrus. Josephus doesn't begin those 70 years until the time of the last deportation, year 23 of Nebuchadnezzar. As far as the Bible is concerned, per Zechariah 1, 70 years after the fall of Jerusalem marked the 2nd year of Darius. But the Jews were still in exile. Jehovah had not yet shown "mercy" to the cities of Judah and Jerusalem. But this is consistent with the 70 years of servitude mentioned by Josephus not having begun until year 23 of Nebuchadnezzar. Thus that 70 years would not have run out until 74 years after the fall of Jerusalem, and thus the Jews had another four years to go. If they were released in the 1st of Cyrus, that means Darius ruled for six years while the Jews were still in exile.
This fulfills the Biblical reference as well that the Jews would serve both Nebuchadnezzar and his SONS. Darius was a grandson of Nebuchadnezzar. It is interesting, therefore, that in Sir Isaac Newton's history for this period, he relates that while Nebuchadnezzar was invading Egypt, Darius ruled on the throne of Babylon:
Here's an excerpt:
611. Cyaxeres Reigns over the Medes.
610. The Princes of the Scythians slain in a feast by Cyaxeres.
609. Josiah slain. Cyaxeres and Nebuchadnezzar overthrow Nineveh, and, by sharing the Assyrian Empire, grow great.
607. Creon the first annual Archon of the Athenians. The second Messian war begins. Cyaxeres makes the Scythians retire beyond Colchos and Iberia, and seizes the Assyrian Provinces of Armenia, Pontus and Cappadocia.
606. Nebuchadnezzar invades Syria and Judaea.
604. Nabopolassar dies, and is succeeded by his Son Nebuchadnezzar, who had already Reigned two years with his father.
600. Darius the Mede, the son of Cyaxeres, is born.
599. Cyrus is born of Mandane, the Sister of Cyaxeres, and daughter of Astyages.
596. Susiana and Elam conquered by Nebuchadnezzar. Caranus and Perdiccas fly from Phidon, and found the Kingdom of Macedon. Phidon introduces Weighs and Measures, and the Coining of Silver Money.
590. Cyaxeres makes war upon Alyattes King of Lydia.
588. The Temple of Solomon is burnt by Nebuchadnezzar. The Messenians being conquired, fly into Sicily, and build Messana.
585. In the sixth year of the Lydian war, a total Eclipse of the Sun, predicted by Thales, May the 28th, puts an end to a Battel between the Medes and Lydians: Whereupon they make Peace, and ratify it by a marriage between Darius Medus the son of Cyaxeres, and Ariene the daughter of Alyattes.
584. Phidon presides in the 49th Olympiad.
580. Phidon is overthrown. Two men chosen by lot, out of the city Elis, to preside in the Olympic Games.
572 Draco is Archon of the Athenians, and makes laws for them.
568. The Amphictious make war upon the Cirrheans, by the advice of Solon, and take Cirrha. Clifthenes, Alcmaeon and Eurolicus commanded the forces of the Amphictions, and were contemporary to Phidon. For Leocides the son of Phidon, and Megacles the son of Alcmaeon, at one and the same time, courted Agarista the daughter of Clifthenes.
569. Nebuchadnezzar invades Egypt. Darius the Mede Reigns.
Excerpt from "A Short Chronicle" - Sir Isaac Newton
So you can hardly claim that the idea of the 70 years not beginning until the last deportation in year 23 of Nebuchadnezzar is an "invention." It's not. It's the traditional Jewish understanding of when the 70 years occurred as confirmed by Josephus. Plus it doesn't contradict the Bible's chronology when Zechariah 1, year 2 of "Darius" is assigned to Darius, the Mede.
So like I said, if you want to start another 70 years for the nations at some other point, be my guest. If you want to split Jeremiah's prophecy between more than one 70-year prophecy. Great. I'm not interested in 70 years of servitude of the nations to Babylon, only the servitude of the Jews for 70 years deported as the last deportation. It just means there are two intepretations of the 70 years. Just because some nations served 70 years to Babylon that began before those last deported did doesn't change anything with respect to the 70-year period from year 23 of Nebuchadnezzar that ends in the 1st of Cyrus following a 6-year rule by Darius the Mede. That is what the Bible indicates.
I may agree with Josephus in this case, but I don't have to invent this concept of the 70 years. It's the traditional Jewish view of the 70 years of "servitude" and Jeremiah's prophecy relating to 70 years. I think the Jews know a bit more about their Bible and history than you or Olof Jonsson, though, don't you think? Regardless of how well you can make your arguments for an earlier 70-year period.
JC