DFing because of doubts

IsaacJS2

I was looking in the Insight book under DFing (it refers you to expelling instead) and found the following list of reasons for DFing:

Some of the offenses that could merit disfellowshipping from the Christian congregation are fornication, adultery, homosexuality, greed, extortion, thievery, lying, drunkenness, reviling, spiritism, murder, idolatry, apostasy, and the causing of divisions in the congregation.

It sounds like doubt in God and/or the WT would all be grounds, but where do they fit under the list? Would they label this as idolatry or apostasy, maybe? The entry for idolatry suggests that replacing God (and I suppose the WT) with something else can be considered idolatry. So I guess replacing God with secularism, atheism, or "worldliness" might fit under this heading. Or is there a direct quote somewhere that I can't find? (I've been checking in the CD-ROM, but not much luck so far)

It's odd, but I can't find a lot regarding secularism/atheism in the references aside from blurbs and personal experiences.

Thanks for any help, especially if you've gone through any of this before.

IsaacJ

Zico

According to the Society, apostasy is when you disagree with any of their beliefs, even just ONE, even if it's a minor one. Disagreeing with the existence of their God would be included in this. There was a CO letter on it, but I wouldn't know where to find it. I've never heard or read of anyone being disfellowshipped for 'idolatry'. I'm not sure if the exact term matters though, they don't announce it anymore, and it all results in the same thing: Shunning.

IsaacJS2

***

it-1p.127Apostasy***

An apostasy among professed Christians was foretold by the apostle Paul at 2 Thessalonians 2:3. He specifically mentioned certain apostates, such as Hymenaeus, Alexander, and Philetus. (1Ti 1:19, 20; 2Ti 2:16-19) Among the varied causes of apostasy set forth in apostolic warnings were: lack of faith (Heb 3:12), lack of endurance in the face of persecution (Heb 10:32-39), abandonment of right moral standards (2Pe 2:15-22), the heeding of the "counterfeit words" of false teachers and "misleading inspired utterances" (2Pe 2:1-3; 1Ti 4:1-3; 2Ti 2:16-19; compare Pr 11:9), and trying "to be declared righteous by means of law" (Ga 5:2-4). While still making profession of faith in God’s Word, apostates may forsake his service by treating lightly the preaching and teaching work that he assigned to followers of Jesus Christ. (Lu 6:46; Mt 24:14; 28:19, 20) They may also claim to serve God but reject his representatives, his visible organization, and then turn to ‘beating’ their former associates to hinder their work. (Jude 8, 11; Nu 16:19-21; Mt 24:45-51) Apostates often seek to make others their followers. (Ac 20:30; 2Pe 2:1, 3) Such ones willfully abandoning the Christian congregation thereby become part of the "antichrist." (1Jo 2:18, 19) As with the apostate Israelites, destruction is likewise foretold for apostates from the Christian congregation.—2Pe 2:1; Heb 6:4-8;

Think I found it. Idolatry might apply, but I guess "lack of faith" above qualifies. My bad.

IsaacJ

BluesBrother

I have expresssed doubt many times to elders, Never any question of d/fing me ....they have to abide by the scripture of Jude 22

"Also continue showing mercy to some that have doubts"

"Pay Attention" book , Unit 5.1

"Those with sincere doubts should be helped, dealt with
mercifully. (Jude 22, 23; w82 9/1 pp. 20-1;w80 8/1
pp. 21-2)

Apostasy includes action taken against true worship of
Jehovah or his established order among his dedicated
people. (Jer. 17:13; 23:15; 28:15, 16; 2 Thess. 2:9, 10)

Persons who deliberately spread (stubbornly hold to and
speak about) teachings contrary to Bible truth as taught
by Jehovah's Witnesses are apostates."

The trick is to present it as a question, not a dogmatic statement of disbelief

Zico

The trick is to present it as a question, not a dogmatic statement of disbelief

But you have to pretend to accept their answer, no matter how lame.

AudeSapere

But you have to pretend to accept their answer, no matter how lame.

Or at least pretend to 'try' to accept their answer...

-Aude.

greendawn

It depends what kind of doubts these are, if they are minor things they won't bother much if they are major like doubting the status of the FDS who is to all intents and purposes the GB then they will want to meet with the individual and clarify the issue and they may decide to expel him. Talking to others about these doubts will speed up the punitive process.

IsaacJS2

I was wondering what the particulars of this were. I suspect there is something specific they look for, something that is officially "crossing the line" before forming a JC but I wasn't sure where the line would be drawn. I briefly admitted that I was an atheist to an in-law a while back but never heard much more about it--other than the fact that I was now a bad associate to her, despite the promise she wouldn't hold the conversation against me. (Yeah, sure...)

In another post, I had asked about people who fade and why they prefer that method to just quitting outright. I was sort of fading (though not deliberately) when I just stopped altogether. Wasn't subtle enough. A week later I was getting 20+ phone calls a day and stopped in the grocery store and pelted with questions. But after a month or so, the surreal love-bombing eased off almost completely. It took about 2 years for things to settle down completely, but those occasional annoyances were worthwhile since I had no direct Witness family. (Just in-laws) I was glad it was over with--I could not have done what many of you have had to do and are doing even now. I can't imagine slipping away over a period of years.

One reason I was asking is because I was thinking about writing some articles regarding the WT and its former members. I was thinking I might start with something about fading and what people with Witness families have to go through just to get away.

IsaacJ

LanDi

What the Monkeys is apostasy ? A Jehovahs Witness relative has accused me of Apostasy - criticising the blood issue !!! Despite the fact that I showed my JW relative scriptures relating to child sacrifice in Jeremiah and explained that the bible states that we abstain from CONSUMING blood (which inhibit the digestion process) so that " it may not be injurious to you" as the bible states. Letting a child die (sacrifice to Molech) is SICK. And he went on quoting the Watchtower - that 60% of blood transfusion recipiants have to be kept on drugs to keep them alive BECAUSE OF THE BLOOD TRANSFUSIONS EFFECTS !!!! What bullsh*t. If that was the case, 58-76 % of the Western world would be on medication constantly to keep them alive - their maths clearly don't add up. I'm an apostate for disagreeing (even quoting scriptures) with " our mother" "gods wife" (surely blashpemous) when the Bible says no one should be appointed to teach us (mark something) !!!!!

The WTS is expert at mind control. Like the song "hotel California" - with the lyrics 'you may never leave' (Foreigner if I remember right)

Still, they do alright out of it - breaking up families, ruining people financially, dominating peoples lives and forcing them into selling magazines and serving a corporation for free, sounds like the corporate dream.............

"Beware of Wolves in sheeps clothing " Jesus Christ

DFing because of doubts

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