Disfellowshiped/Disassociated VS. Other non JWs

by pierogi 14 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

• 

  pierogi

  I sometimes wonder about this:

  If someone is disfellowshiped or disassociates themselves from the JWs, they are to be considered "worldly", right? If JWs can talk to other non JWs, why are non JWs who used to be

  JWs so much worse that they can't talk to them? Besides, when they disfellowship people or when people disassociate themselves, they are actually punishing the current JWs because

  they are the ones that are NOT ALLOWED to talk. Also, didn't they used to announce at the meetings specifically if the person was disfellowshiped or whether they disassociated

  themselves? I don't remember if that is true, is it? If it is, don't people wonder why they changed it to the same generic annoucement that they are no longer JWs? They probably don't

  want others to know that people are actually choosing not to be a part of the organization. If it is true, does any one know why the announcement changed?

  Anyway, I'd like to get everbody's input!
• 

  looking_glass

  If someone is disfellowshiped or disassociates themselves from the JWs, they are to be considered "worldly", right? If JWs can talk to other non JWs, why are non JWs who used to be

  Not the same. A jw who "turns their back on Jah" is like one who is a "dog returning to its vomit" in the jw book. They knowingly leave god. As for worldly person they do not know god and thus they are ignorant and must be saved by the jws. Huge difference.
• 

  SirNose586

  If someone is disfellowshiped or disassociates themselves from the JWs, they are to be considered "worldly", right? If JWs can talk to other non JWs, why are non JWs who used to be

  JWs so much worse that they can't talk to them? Besides, when they disfellowship people or when people disassociate themselves, they are actually punishing the current JWs because...

  DA'd or DF'd witnesses are much, much worse to them because they figure that you must be some sort of wicked person to taste the "delightful, correct words of truth" and either consciously throw it away, or otherwise repudiate the GB's words. People who were never witnesses are all potential converts. As such, their "wicked" ways can be tolerated because once they come into the lovebombing of the KH, they will surely want to conform to Borg standards.

  While it is true that the witnesses who shun are really the ones prevented from talking to the outcast ones, the punishment is, in theory, supposed to be more painful for the outcast. If the GB's words were well heeded, every dub should know no "worldly" person well enough to call them friend; therefore, the person who has no family outside of the religion and no friends outside of the religion will be well and truly punished. If the person who was shunned used to be popular and influential, then yes, I would say df'ing is a punishment for the shunners as well. They lose the company of a stimulating and intelligent person. But seeing as how the truly stimulating and intelligent usually want nothing to do with the witnesses, then really the shunners aren't punished by not talking to people. If everyone is supposed to be a Borg drone, then if they lose one, it's no big deal.
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  Madame Quixote

  D'fed and D'a'ed ex-jws aren't "worse" than non jws; it's just that they got smart and figured out they belonged to a cult, (or they were on the way to figuring it out), and were then labelled by the elders as "unrepentant," thus they got kicked out, shunned.

  That (shunning of questioning members) minimizes the risk that others will also "get smart" and leave.

  No association, no knowledge, no smarts.

  JW organization doesn't like it's members to be that smart. They like followers. When followers get "smart" they lead, and if they lead well, the congregation shrinks and people leave with the smarter leaders, (rather than being led by the nose by a book publishing company and its "elders").
• 

  pierogi

  Looking Glass, that just takes me to a whole other topic which can get me started. I hate how just because someone decides to leave the organization, they also decide to leave the truth and also God. It could never be because they are doing it for the truth. The truth does not mean the same as the watchtower. I know that to JWs it's worse to know the truth and deny it than to not know it, which is how they think when thinking about people who leave the org. I just don't agree with their thinking, that's all.
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  pierogi

  Does anyone know about my announcement question?
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  Inquisitor

  If JWs can talk to other non JWs, why are non JWs who used to be JWs so much worse that they can't talk to them? -pierogi

  A deserter/excommunicated member has the understated potential of pulling active Witnesses out of their religiously deluded state. Imagine if the ex JW could spill the beans on why they left: strongly biased judicial committee, logically sound doubts about JW theology and JW's non-Scriptural, patriachal rules, sex scandals of JWs in high places, etc.

  The Org cannot risk losing both the member who earned their wrath and his/her family. Witness numbers depend a good deal on family membership.

  INQ
• 

  looking_glass

  Also, didn't they used to announce at the meetings specifically if the person was disfellowshiped or whether they disassociated themselves? I don't remember if that is true, is it? If it is, don't people wonder why they changed it to the same generic annoucement that they are no longer JWs? They probably don't want others to know that people are actually choosing not to be a part of the organization. If it is true, does any one know why the announcement changed?

  Yes, they use to announce the reason the person was DF'd. But I believe a lawsuit put an end to that. Then I think they slightly changed it and they were sued again. So now they just say the person is "no longer a jw". I suppose because that is as vague as they can be, but still putting everyone one on notice not to communicate w/ the person any more.

  As for your response to my post ... that is the rub isn't it. To the jw, the minute you no longer want to be a jw is the same as turning your back on god, there is no other way to look at it in their eyes.
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  pierogi

  Looking glass,

  Maybe they changed the anouncements for legal reasons and not because of what I said. If I disassoctiated myself I'd want people to know. On the other hand, if I was DFed, I wouldn't!

  lol.

  To Madame Quixote and Inquisitor:

  So shunning could actually be for population control while the JWs believe it's out of love for the DFed and also for their own protection agaist the apostates. Hmm...
• 

  Junction-Guy

  In the old days they used to announce the person as disfellowshipped for conduct unbecoming a christian, then they just started saying they were simply disfellowshipped. Since the beginning of the internet, more and more JW's started disassociating themselves, and it really started making the JW religion look bad, plus im sure many people were wondering why so many people would freely leave "The Truth" Now they simply say that so and so is no longer a JW, and most JW's will probably just think they committed immorality, and wouldnt give it a second thought. I believe they chose this new tactic in order to hide the fact that so many are discovering the real truth about the so called "Truth" and leaving due to that.