Athiest Elders?

by AK - Jeff 7 Replies latest jw friends

  • AK - Jeff
    AK - Jeff

    This thought is inspired by hopie's thread about going undercover to rescue her daughter.

    I have often wondered if any others have done the same, but for differing reasons?

    Before I left, and when I had become aware that something was wrong with the 'men appointed by Holy Spirit' doctrine that elevates elders to the full rank of Pharisee, I considered the possibility of moving to an area in which I was unknown and beginning the correct politics needed to 'make elder'. I wanted to see if I could go from disgruntled, unsure this was even God's organization, to 'elder in shekinah light standing' in less than two years. Mainly to just prove a point - that anyone could do that - even an athiest could do it.

    Shortly after, those insane thoughts left my mind and I left the organization behind.

    But I always wondered if any others had done the same to test thier doubts in some area or another.

    Sorry this thread seemed to be a good idea when I thought of it - now it seems to kind of rambling. Such is the plight of the middle aged mind. LOL


  • freetosee

    I’m convinced that many elders don’t believe in jwism especially among the wt higher ups. They live it for the double honour, and remember the paedophile elders. Yes, there are different reasons for living this kind of double life.
    After reading coc for the first time I thought it could be used as a guide to become an elder, because it tells you what kind of local leaders the wts really wants.
    I thought of becoming an elder in order to expose the wt. If there wasn’t the great disappointment when realizing that you are part of a cult there would be much opportunity to deal with the org differently -not hoping and waiting for Jehovah. Some fading elders I believe are providing valuable insider’s info.
    Your thought is not insane, undercover operations in other fields are very successful, but in my case it is unrealistic, since I am already marked as apostate and I couldn’t stomach supporting and enforcing wt policy. Freetosee

  • Inquisitor

    It's not just the tedium of climbing up the JW hierarchy.

    I could never bring myself to give those talks where I would tell youths to avoid higher education, to avoid worldly peers, to obey more, think less. I cannot bring myself to tell the brothers that the arbitrary blood doctrine is Bible based and watch them lose loved ones in emergencies. The cost of pretense is too high. It would be worse than if I had unknowingly caused them suffering like a typical ambitious and devout Dub.

    And if one cannot suffer to deliver the Watchtower mandates, how could one succeed in becoming an "elder bathed in shekinah light"?


  • james_woods

    I hardly can imagine any other designation you could place on such worthies as Hayden Covington and Judge Rutherford. They both lived their lives as if there wasn't any God whatsoever except for their own mad plans and desires.

    I also knew more than one ordinary elder with a very cynical life viewpoint - they actually expressed (mostly while drinking), well, what if there isn't a God, at least we know we are covering our bases...

    In like spirit(s?) I guess Hayden did do a kind of last minute deathbed reconversion to be on the right side of that big supreme court in the sky, just in case.

  • Gander

    I did this personally. I made it to MS and was about to be appointed Elder when I decided I no longer had the stomach for it and resigned. They tried to talk me out of resigning (stepping down). Then they waited over three months before announcing it hoping I would still change my mind.

    I started out to prove it wasn't appointment by holy spirit and felt I proved it fully to myself. It was strictly politics and knowing who to do what for.

    My problem was that I am much too moral to be dogmatically preaching something I don't believe. The shepherding visits and counseling of individuals was what really got to me as in several cases these people were really trying to good and got totally trampled by the elder I was accompanying.

  • Elsewhere

    I can't speak for an Elders, but before I left I was an Atheist Ministerial Servant.

    I think I was appointed by Holy Molly Spirit!

  • blondie

    I always considered elders atheists who would do things they believed God felt was wrong IF they would not be found out or seen by humans on earth. As if being seen by God had no validity; which indicated they indirectly did not believe he existed or had any power over their lives.


    (Ezekiel 8:12) And he proceeded to say to me: "Have you seen, O son of man, what the elderly ones of the house of Israel are doing in the darkness, each one in the inner rooms of his showpiece? For they are saying, ‘Jehovah is not seeing us. Jehovah has left the land.’"


    w87 4/15 p. 14 par. 16 Gaining Peace With God Through Dedication and Baptism ***

    While Bible knowledge is essential, the "mark" involves more than head knowledge. For instance, in the vision given to Ezekiel, likely the elders executed for offering up incense to false gods had extensive knowledge of Jehovah’s written Word. But their behavior behind closed doors showed that they were not true worshipers. (Ezekiel 8:7-12; 9:6)

  • AK - Jeff
    AK - Jeff

    I do recall some points in an older experience about either Nazi Germany or Communist Russia in the period leading up to WWII, in which the government assigned many men the responsiblility of 'infiltration' of the society. Many got 'appointed' eldership, and these men later betrayed the brothers and sisters. And these were totally Godless men from the start, they did not 'go bad' with time - I pointed this matter out to elders over the years who rationalized it away with 'Well, Jehovah was allowing a test of the brothers at that time.'

    I can no longer find the articles - don't know if the WTS has buried them or I just don't know where to look any longer.

    A personal clincher for me - back when I was legitimately 'reaching out' - was a CO telling me that it was not a love of the brotherhood that was the primary qualifier - it was the ability to 'work smoothly with the local body of elders'. Of course that was the reason I was never appointed - a lack of ass-kissing talent. Still don't have it.


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