Still ANOTHER Elder says: "But what does it matter!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!"

by Lady Liberty 22 Replies latest jw friends

  • Lady Liberty
    Lady Liberty

    Well, Things are getting ugly around here!! Just got a call from my best friend, who her and her husband have been fading for some time. Apparently her husband arived at work (he owns his own business) only to be dropped in on by a relative "Elder"! He has been trying to corner him for some time, but has managed to avoid him until today. Apparently a Elder from my friends hall visited his cousins hall and they got to talking, thus spurred on another attempt to corner him. After 3 hours, and going over every topic under the sun, the whole 607 issue, disfellowshipping, holidays, birthdays etc. he finally left! No doubt to run to his Father who is also a Elder to see how they should proceed! Amazingly, the Elder made comments almost exactly like all the others recently posted when asked questions. "WHAT DOES IT MATTER??? Yes the 607 date has holes in it, but what does it matter??" I CANNOT BELIEVE IT!!!! These guys must be trained to say the SAME thing!! It calls to mind a post Rock hound did recently statements made from the "Gentile Times Reconsidered" book are VERY profound! What do you think? If I hear "What does it matter one more time I think I will SCREAM!!!" Maybe some of you who were or are Elders can tell us, are you taught to respond like this to questions??

    Sincerely,

    Lady Liberty

    Heres the post from Rockhound:

    "So what's the big deal about the date 607 B.C. being off by 20 years?" "That was a long time ago, and I can't see where it really matters"

    Many of us have heard comments like the above when we tell our friends, and relatives our concerns about the society's chronology that is used to arrive at the year 1914. "Can't you just put this all behind you, and come back to the meetings?" seems to be their way of solveing this problem. Maybe we could just spray "WINDEX" on this problem ( like in the movie "My Big Fat Greek Wedding") and this whole problem would disappear.

    As the book "The Gentile Times Reconsidered" states: " Few people are fully cognizant of the very central role played by chronology in the claims and teachings of the Watch Tower Society. Even many of Jehovah's Witnesses are not fully aware of the indissoluble connection between the Society's chronology and the message they preach from door to door. Confronted by the many evidences against their chronology, some Jehovah's Witnesses tend to downplay it as something they somehow can do without. "Chronology is not so important, after all," they say. Many Witnesses would prefer not to discuss the subject at all. Just how important, then, is the chronology for the Watch Tower organization?" " An examination of the evidence demonstrates that it constitutes the very foundation for all the claims and message of this movement."

    As we can see from the following statement, the date 1914 constitutes the very core of the "Good News" that over six million witnesses faithfully preach from door to door, world wide.

    Notice the importance that is given the date 1914 in the Watchtower:

    "Let the honest-hearted person compare the kind of preaching of the gospel done by the religious systems of Christendom during all the centuries with that done by Jehovah's Witnesses since the end of World War I in 1918. They are not one and the same kind. That of Jehovah's Witnesses is really "gospel" or "good news," as of God's heavenly kingdom that was established by the enthronement of his Son Jesus Christ at the end of the Gentile Times in 1914." (Watchtower, May 1, 1981, p. 17)

    A Jehovah's Witness who attempts to down play the role of chronology by making comments like the above, simply does not realize that he or she is radically undermining the major message of the "Good News" as it is preached by the society today.

    Major claims about the date 1914 should require major proofs that the method of arriving at this date is relieable. For this date to be credible , it must come from an accurate starting point. Thus, the controversy over the date 607 B.C. Any proofs should be rock solid, and have much evidence to verify it is in fact accurate. Have you checked out this date yourself?

    Trying to make 607 B.C. harmonize with the evidence, is like trying to put 10 pounds of potatoes in a 5 pound bag. It just doesn't work!!!

    ROCKHOUND

  • garybuss
    garybuss

    To these people no teachings matter. All that matters is they WANT to be Witnesses. They accept everything required to be accepted because they WANT to be Witnesses. They shun us if we leave, or if we question, or if they just don't like us because they WANT to be Witnesses.

    Did I mention that they do it all because they WANT to be Witnesses?

  • Scully
    Scully

    Let's put the shoes on the other foot.

    To the JW, it matters a great deal that the Catholic Church teaches that God is a Trinity, that Mary was always a virgin, that Jesus died on a cross. It matters a great deal to JWs when other churches have it all wrong.

    JWs are willing to point out even the most minute flaws of other belief systems - because it matters a great deal that one's worship be based on TRUTH. Except when that belief system originates with the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society.

  • New Worldly Translation
    New Worldly Translation

    That's very true Gary.

    I've had heated discussions with my parents about 607, UN NGO membership, past failed prophecy etc etc. I argue with facts that they can't deny so their whole argument veers to a purely personal one 'that they want to be witnesses and they couldn't cope with not being one'

  • freedomlover
    freedomlover

    I know how mind boggling this can be. I really feel that people who answer this way to PROOF are those that mentally can not handle what the consequences will be if all they've ever believed is a lie. I really think it's the mind and bodies way of survival for these people.

    When I first left the only illustration I can liken this too is if all your life you've been told the red crayon is blue and then one day you meet someone who says the red crayon is red. It makes no sense to your mind, almost incomprehensible.

    IMO - you have reached more people than anyone I know with this info. You will not convince the majority I'm afraid.

  • Lady Liberty
    Lady Liberty

    Let's put the shoes on the other foot.

    To the JW, it matters a great deal that the Catholic Church teaches that God is a Trinity, that Mary was always a virgin, that Jesus died on a cross. It matters a great deal to JWs when other churches have it all wrong.

    JWs are willing to point out even the most minute flaws of other belief systems - because it matters a great deal that one's worship be based on TRUTH. Except when that belief system originates with the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society. Dear Scully, Boy, do you have THAT right!!! I am going to use that analagy, the next time someone says this to me!! You hit the nail on the head! I would like to hear their reply to THAT!!! Sincerely, Lady Liberty

  • Lady Liberty
    Lady Liberty

    Did I mention that they do it all because they WANT to be Witnesses?Dear Gary,

    How TRUE!! They are lovers of TRADITION rather than lovers of TRUTH! It really actually makes me SICK!

    L.L.

  • Lady Liberty
    Lady Liberty


    I really think it's the mind and bodies way of survival for these people.


    When I first left the only illustration I can liken this too is if all your life you've been told the red crayon is blue and then one day you meet someone who says the red crayon is red. It makes no sense to your mind, almost incomprehensible.


    IMO - you have reached more people than anyone I know with this info. You will not convince the majority I'm afraid.

    Dear Freedomlover,

    You are ABSOLUTELY correct! I am just AMAZED! I am guilty of not wanting to hear anything negative from my parents. However, when I discovered, through my own questions, that what I thought to be the Truth was NOT the Truth, I rejected it! I have such a hard time understanding how these "spiritual leaders" can continue to falsely lead the flock! They carry so much BLOODGUILT!! You are right, the majority will continue to see the red crayon as blue, but, I have hope! I feel a burning desire to try and help as many as I can! I can only imagine what I would do if I would of allowed my daughter to die over the blood issue, only to find out later, what we have! I want to try and help as many as I can "wake up" before they maybe faced with that very situation! Even if ONE person checks these things out and are helped, it will have been worth ALL the effort!!

    Sincerely,

    Lady Liberty

  • freedomlover
    freedomlover

    Go For it then! I agree, if you do help just one person then it's worth it. In my case, I am not surprised anymore by the blatant ignorance and bloodguilt.

    Those who want to find out the truth will, and those who prefer tradition over truth will continue in that way also.

    I know when I get to talk with someone about the issues I feel so good inside to prove it to myself again. It just reaffirms my belief that I have finally found the TRUTH.

  • Virgochik
    Virgochik

    I think it's the same with my parents, like Gary Buss said, they just WANT to be Dubs. They aren't too stupid to have noticed things that smell like a rat, but they are old now. What purpose would they have in their day, if not to do Witless things? Who would be their friends if they stopped? They've gone to the Hall almost all their lives, and they really don't want to know any better.

    When people get really old, I think it's just kinder, in some cases to let them have their fantasy and be content with it. Their lives are almost over and they can die happy.

    For younger people, we have to try to save them from wasting away their lives away, if they can be reached.

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