I posted this yesterday under the topic Reasonings on Mexico-Malawi fiasco topic. Teresa advised me to create a new topic, so that many can see it. So here it is... I'd really appreciate your help... Hello everyone. I am writing from Turkey, Istanbul. I have been searching the internet these past few months about JW's "dirty clothes". the reason I am doing this research is that, I want to know the truth. I am raised as a JW. I am still a sister (officially). My husband is a very devoted JW. But he is very open to discussion. I have trouble finding concrete facts to prove JW's are wrong. He does not want to trust the books written by ex-JW's (such as Raymond's books). I really would like to prove him, and myself that this military service thing in Mexico is real. I mean the JW's there were "bribing" the officials in order to get the Cartilla. How can I prove this? I thought about writing to the bethel in NY and in Mexico.. Is there anyone here who is mexican or lives in Mexico, and who could give me details about this? I would really really appreciate your help. I am trying to make my decision, I am torn apart. My husband is about to go to military service and he will be in trouble as he will refuse to wear uniform and take weapon. I do not want my husband to waste his 2-3 years , or maybe more, in prison for nothing. In Turkey the military service for males is compulsory... My parents (my father was an elder for 15 years, and my mother very devoted JW) has decided JW is wrong; they are not telling anyone just yet, because I told them I could not handle this change for now.(psychologically I mean. I already had some issues, and this was like the final blow..) I am feeling I was fooled my whole life. I missed a lot of good things bec of the organizations stupid rules. I am trying to find concrete proofs to make my final decision. And I want to save my husband as well. I feel in my heart, actually now I am sure, that this religion is false. I need your help...
I need help and support about the Mexican, military service issues...
Hi sole, welcome to the forum! I'm going to bump this back up so that people see it.
I don't really know much info on this personally but I know some people do. I wonder why nobody has lent in their 2 cents. Sole really needs our help. HELLOOOO OUT THERE IN JWD LAND!!!
This is the issue that got me out of the borg. After reading Ray's book and his account of the issue, I asked 3 people about it. None of them have gotten back to me as of yet.
My older brother who use to be a witness back in the late 80's used to vacation in Cancun. He and his wife would visit congregations while there. I just got off the phone with him cause I couldn't remember what year it was that he told me that while visiting a Kingdom Hall, (it was 1991),he found it strange that no one was singing the Kingdom Melodies ( they were just listening to the music ). He inquired about it and was told that they never sang songs before in the Hall, so they would listen to the songs to get the Melodie. This confirmed for me what Ray said about the Mexican witnesses not praying or singing at the halls.They were registered as a Cultural Group and not as a Religion. They were not allowed to pray or sing songs. This all changed when the Government no longer held onto Religious properties.
I guess one could write the Mexican gov. to confirm the status of Jehovah's Witnesses as far as when they actually registered as a religion. I will try to find out for you and post my findings.
Welcome to the board - The Claw
Sole, you wrote: I have trouble finding concrete facts to prove JW's are wrong.
This sounds really hard to understand. First, me thinks you have it upside down. They made the claims, it's up to them to prove their claims. They can't prove ONE claim. You were asking for "concrete facts" weren't you? Just ask them for "factual" proof.
Me thinks you will be happy if you do some homework to learn what is evidence, and what is proof, what's the difference between objective and subjective and what's the difference between implicit and explicit. Witnesses work to avoid and confuse, to poison the well, and kill the messenger.
One reason it's hard to disprove the Witness story is because it's all make believe, all made up. It's hard to prove a delusion and equally hard to disprove unless it's looked at as a delusion. Then it's easy.
Most people who come to me to try to disprove the Witnesses are not so happy when I ask them to first "prove" their own beliefs and assumptions before they challenge the Witnesses. That's usually the last I hear from them. If I do hear from them, and they were Bible educated as children, I ask them to read the story titled, Kissing Hank's Ass, three times and then read The Age Of Reason by Thomas Paine. Both are on line free.
Hi Sole and Welcome to JWDB , my husband is from a border town (border with Mexico) and he knows that the majority of brothers there were completely aware of this bribing thing, you see they have family and freinds across in Mexico, so they know how things are done there, so yes, this is 100% true, my husband and I are still "officialy" JW's. We are currently attending some meetings, but no longer believe the JW's are the true religion, we are what is called faders, we still have family and longtime freinds in this religion and are still trying to help as many as we can to come out of this Cult. I hope you do alot of reading here because there's alot of great information and we are blessed to have some great people on this forum, very intelligent and caring people. Enjoy your stay, post often and ask questions I'm sure someone will provide you with answers.
Here is a link to Topics, scroll down about a quarter of the page and you will see the info for Mexico:
There are some Spanish posters here occasionally and they may see this and be able to add their own personal experience. Also, if you haven't already done so go to:
There may be some info listed on Main Page and you can also click on Watchtower News at the top of the page and go into the archives...
Hoping this helps,