Any PUBLICATION say that heavens doors were closed in 1935 ???

by run dont walk 31 Replies latest watchtower bible

  • feelinsketchy

    Sorry to be vague, but the fall of 2000 to winter of 01 there was a WT that dealt with the growing number of "anointed." It explained it away by saying that these were probably overzealous or mentally unstable. If memory serves, it also made the claim that the number was sealed in 1931-35 and that any since then were replacements.

    A quick tour of birth and death rates of the World Population Study website reveals that any sealed in 1935 are dead and even the older GB such as Sidlick, Barr etc are replacements and the new GB are replacements of replacements. Just make it stop!

  • garybuss

    The replacement theory is hilarious. To be a faithful and discreet slave, that slave had to REMAIN faithful and discreet until the end of the test. It was at the END of the test that the faithful and discreet slave was identified, not in midstream. IF a slave was not faithful until the end of the test, that was an identification of a foolish slave or an evil slave. There isn't a precedent for an evil slave to be replaced by a faithful slave.

    I like the Second Adventists parable of the virgins and the lamp oil better than the evil slave one the Watch Tower uses.

  • fahrvegnugen

    Yes, I knew a couple of sisters who felt they had "received the heavenly calling." They were not the crazy types and as far as I know are still very active. Also one of my distant relations who I've met only once has been a partaker for years. Then you would also read about brothers being added to the GB who had obviously been baptized long after 1935.

    The thought would always go through my mind: Gee, for every one of these newly "anointed ones," one of the original chosen ones somewhere in the world had to have been so unfaithful as to have been utterly rejected by God. Where the hell are these elderly people who were baptized before 1935, and after all those years of faithful service turned so rotten as to warrant being replaced? What did they do--up and leave the old folks home to smoke crack and hire prostitutes?

    I think the Society themselves doesn't really know what to think about the number of partakers staying eternally at 8500. I'm sure they thought this number would dwindle on it's own, but human nature is such that in a religious group you're always going to have a certain percentage who think they have been chosen by god for some sort of higher calling--it's human nature.

  • FaithfulDoubter

    Interesting, is there ANY biblical evidence that supports a 1931-1935 date? Or is this just more evidentlys and apparentlys going on... They sure are getting good about using those qualifiers aren't they? *sighs*

  • garybuss

    fahrvegnugen, In the parable of the slaves, did you see any slave receive the designation "faithful and discreet" slave before the master returned? Or did the designation come AFTER the master rejoined the slaves and the test ended? In the case of the Jehovah's Witnesses, the slaves could only get the designation "faithful slave" AFTER they died.

    If the Society acknowledges this, then they either have error in BOTH their heavenly line doctrine AND they have error in their replacement doctrine. If they have error in either, their appointment doctrine and claim to being a channel falls apart like a two dollar suitcase in the rain.

  • mustang


    I wouldn’t call it a "local thing"; I would say that it is better described as PERVASIVE. It was little talked about when I was "in" (forever ago), but was discussed in quiet small groups. While I don't recall directly hearing it from the platform, the vague references and quotes such as those that TD mentioned were typical.

    The important thing was that the emphasis on the Great Crowd became very heavy; by implication, the "heavenly hope" was phased out. You were supposed to get the message that 1935 was the limit. Of course, all of these things were promoted upon the inspirations of whoever was "driving the message": Russell, Rutherford and Franz, generally.

    But there was always an undercurrent of discussing "replacements"; generally it was "reading in between the lines" and was frequently linked to some "Bethel source". (Lego's mention of Franz actually discussing "replacements" is a great find; this amounts to "suspicions confirmed".)

    I did discuss this with a number of the "anointed"; they would quote the "1935 party line" and indicate that you could dig those things up by careful reading but would hint that the matter wasn't really settled.

    As with all things of such speculative nature, they are not be settled at all by lectures and conjectures. Now when a prophecy times out and really goes bad, that is different: for example, when 2014 is behind us the 'generation scheme' would really go to RIP status for even the worst diehard holdouts.


  • stillajwexelder

    *** re chap. 19 p. 116 Sealing the Israel of God ***

    The general selection of the true Israel of God proceeded from the day of Pentecost 33 C.E. down to 1935 when, at a historic convention of Jehovah’s Witnesses in Washington, D.C., emphasis was shifted to the ingathering of a great crowd with earthly life prospects (Revelation 7:9)

  • stillajwexelder

    *** w84 2/15 p. 18 The Recent Pen for "Other Sheep" ***


    We note that up till the spring of the year 1935 the remnant of the spiritual Israelites who belong inside "this fold" were preoccupied with gathering into that fold, or pen, the final ones needed to make up the full membership of 144,000 spiritual Israelites. These would be the last to be brought under the new covenant as mediated by the Fine Shepherd, who died as the Lamb of God to provide "the blood of an everlasting covenant." (Hebrews 13:20; Psalm 50:5) What, then, happened in 1935?


    A general convention of Jehovah’s Witnesses was called together at the capital of the United States of America, Washington, D.C., to which God-fearing Bible Students who were like the non-Israelite Jonadab were specially invited to attend. On the second day of the convention, May 31, the then president of the Watch Tower Bible and Tract Society thrilled the conventioners with his address on Revelation 7:9-17, regarding the "great multitude." (Revelation 7:9, Authorized Version) He explained that this foretold "great multitude" was to be made up of the "other sheep," those foreshadowed by Jonadab, or Jehonadab, the non-Israelite man who accompanied Jehu, the king of Israel, in a display of zeal for Jehovah and against the worshipers of the false god Baal. (2 Kings 10:15-28; Jeremiah 35:6-19) Thus Jehu showed "toleration of no rivalry toward Jehovah," or according to the Authorized Version, "zeal for the LORD."—2 Kings 10:16.

  • stillajwexelder

    *** w69 12/15 p. 756 "Make Disciples"—Till When? ***

    It is likewise evident that the vision of the "great crowd" (Rev. 7:9) was given to John the apostle after he had the vision of the 144,000 sealed spiritual Israelites. Hence this vision would apply now, specifically since 1935, when the sealing of the 144,000 spiritual Israelites appears coming to its close.

  • stillajwexelder

    *** uw chap. 14 p. 112 ‘I Make a Covenant With You for a Kingdom’ ***

    A "great crowd" out of all nations would be gathered, with the thrilling prospect of surviving the great tribulation and living forever in perfection amid an earthly Paradise. When we consider what has actually occurred, it seems evident that the heavenly calling in general was completed by about the year 1935 C.E., when the earthly hope of the "great crowd" was clearly discerned. Since then there have been brought into association with the comparatively few thousand remaining ones of the heavenly class millions of worshipers of Jehovah who are earnestly hoping to live forever right here on earth.


    Does this mean that none are now being called by God for heavenly life? Until the final sealing is done, it is possible that some few who have that hope may prove unfaithful, and others will have to be chosen to take their place. But it seems reasonable that this would be a rare occurrence.

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