Actually I didn't mean shunning. Look beyond what they do to the psychological effect they have. They come out with alot of the same issues. The methods they have may be different. They're beliefs may be different. But read stories from those that leave and and how they're affected internally is the same. They wind up with alot of the same traumas.
Mormons and JW: same horror story, different halloween costume!
by dezpbem 28 Replies latest jw friends
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Sam the Man
I got one name for you all: DONNY OSMOND. Now can we finally agree that all Mormons are sad pathetic losers?
Ok...ok...not all...
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lisavegas420
One more than I'll stop...
http://www.wherestheoutrage.org/articles/art_153.php
The Hidden Heartache in Amish and Mennonite Communities
July 12, 2004Adapted from the Intelligencer Journal.
LANCASTER COUNTY, PA - From the Amish hayloft to the quilted Mennonite bedside, the cries of abused women and whimpers of violated children are often stifled by the very church leaders who have been called to help.
A Mennonite woman screams inwardly as her husband drags her across the floor to a bed where he forces himself on her - again. When she went to police after years of abuse, church leaders excommunicated her from her church. They won't take her back until she promises to submit to her husband and never call the police again.
An Amish boy's face is scratched by the straw as an Amish man from his church sodomizes him - again. Church leaders tried to make his parents say it never happened. They almost excommunicated his mother for telling non-Amish people about it, including someone who notified police.
A Mennonite woman tries to stop her husband from pinching, kicking and beating their children with a belt, but nothing works. Church leaders told her she needs to submit, be a better Christian and have sex more often so he would be nicer to her and the children.
To many people, the thought that Mennonite and Amish folk - known for their work ethic, humility, gentleness and orderliness - would abuse their spouses and children is beyond belief.
The public sees large families of well-behaved children, straight rows of colorful flowers and tidy homes. They see church members cooperating to send vast quantities of food to poor countries, homemakers delivering meals to a shut-in, strong men ready to lend a hand at a moment's notice and entire churches working together to build a barn in one day.
Many are exactly the God-fearing, loving people they appear to be - even the abuse victims say that. But that makes it even harder to believe that they would not see or would tolerate abuse within their close-knit communities.
"If you're not hearing about it, it's not because it's not there," said Roger Steffy, an ordained Mennonite minister, who admits he was sexually abusive to his wife. "There's a tremendous amount of secrecy around that stuff."
"There's definite sexual abuse and violence that happens in groups of conservative Mennonite and Amish. I have no doubt about that," said Steffy.
Denial of the issue runs high, however, not just in the general community, but from church leaders and members, said Steffy.
"Our people don't do these kinds of things. We're good people," said Steffy, describing the thinking of the churches' own skeptics.
The topic of abuse in these churches - unified in their Anabaptist beliefs of nonresistance, adult baptism and nonconformity to mainstream values - is so sensitive that not one of the 20 victims, family members or conservative church leaders who talked to the newspaper would allow their names to be used. Even some counselors who work with members of these churches would only agree to be interviewed if their names would not be used.
No studies have been done to quantify the amount of abuse that goes on within Lancaster County Mennonite and Amish churches, several counselors said, but a 1997 statement by the two boards which make up Mennonite Church USA suggested that "the incidence of family violence may be as high in Mennonite homes as in the general population."
"We should not have these things," a local conservative Mennonite bishop said, "but at the same time, we're human and we can't say we are what we'd like to be."
The difference, according to counselors and victims, is the way abuse is handled. As members of a tightly controlled church system and tradition-bound culture, the victims, primarily women, turn to their male deacons, ministers and bishops for help.
Instead of the listening ear and help they seek, they feel blamed and shamed instead.
Wielding an uncompromising belief in the sanctity of marriage, man's authority over women, forgiveness and resolution of conflict without the law - all beliefs based on Biblical passages - the leaders "shoot their wounded." -
willyloman
Wielding an uncompromising belief in the sanctity of marriage, man's authority over women, forgiveness and resolution of conflict without the law - all beliefs based on Biblical passages - the leaders "shoot their wounded."
As do dub leaders. Which ought to be the first clue that these are not followers of the Jesus whose story is told in the Bible, despite their claim that their beliefs are biblical.
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Qcmbr
These are the similarities..and some differences I think.
Similarities:
1/ Very Missionary Minded
2/ Thrive on persecution
3/ Millenialist
4/ God's true church
5/ Men only have priesthood
6/ Heirarchical leadership
7/ Total commitment expected
8/ Fundamentalist basis
9/ Baptism by immersion
10/ Religious community
11/ New light
12/ Property ownership
13/ Importance of obedience to laws
14/ Growth Rates
15/ Leaders as personalities who are looked up to.
16/ Confessional system.
17/ Multiple weekly and Sunday meetings.
Differences:
1/ Concept and relationship to God
2/ Tithing
3/ Sacrament/communion
4/ Shunning
5/ Blood issue
6/ Health Code
7/ Temple
8/ Education
9/ Military Service
10/ Polygamy
11/ Pioneer trek
12/ Food storage
13/ Charitable acts
14/ Who will get to heaven/hell
15/ Prophets
16/ Holy Ghost
17/ Personal Revelation
18/ Gifts of the spirit
19/ Healing
I think when anyone leaves any organisation that is as immersive be it religious / political / social etc.. they get a physical and mental shock to their system that can exhibit itself in a range of behaviours and (often extremes) of feelings(anger, revenge, sickness, disgust, happiness, feeling free, hope, despair etc..) One thing I see with ex-LDS is that many profess that they still believe but have 'faded' out of activity, some hate the church and want to have nothing more to do with it, some people hate the church and can't leave it alone, very few are ambivalent. I guess that's partially true here. -
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Ianone
[image]http://home.earthlink.net/~twainable/sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderpictures/president_george_herbert_walker_bush_skull_and_bones.jpg[/image]
sorry, just trying to figure out how to use HTML code from Mozilla -
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garybuss
I'm convinced the injury caused by the groups is an institutionalization type damage. When we leave we often suffer from post exit syndrome much that same as prisoners exiting prisons. Look up "post exit syndrome" and see what you think.
