Help needed: Dubs doing ANYTHING inside a Church. Borg policy?

Open mind

OK here's the deal. I posted about my son being asked to perform in a non-religious recital which is scheduled to take place inside a local church. Here's the thread if you want the full story.

http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/9/133797/1.ashx

In a nutshell, my wife and I were thinking that there's no way the local dubs are gonna think it's OK for him to perform there if they get wind of it.

Now that I'm such a jaded JWDer it never even dawned on me to actually do some dubbie research on the topic. So last night I do a search on WT Library and all I can come up with is a QFR from the 1970's about whether it's OK for dubs to attend a wedding in a church.

Per the article, it's OK (read: conscience matter) to attend even if the ceremony includes religious rituals as long as the dubbie doesn't participate in any religious activities.

So, I'm thinking my wife and I have blown this recital thing way out of proportion. Couldn't you use the same logic for a recital? The article made it sound like even less of a big deal if the wedding was stricly a civil ceremony.

Does anybody know of anything in writing that would come down harder on my son performing? I'm hoping that there isn't. Please let me know your thoughts.

Open Mind

LovesDubs

Is he performing RELIGIOUS music at the church or just regular tunes and the venue just happens to be a church?

Dont make a big deal out of it. If he isnt participating in a ritual there, as in if he is attending a wedding at a church...it's a conscience matter.

Anybody who gives a kid shit about this out to be hung out to dry someplace. They dare not.

Atlantis

Open mind:

Kingdom Ministry-November-1974

10

min: Local announcements and appropriate Announcements from OurKingdomMinistry. Include financial report. Remind all to bring OurMinistry book to Service Meeting next week.

23

min: "Have Your ‘Perceptive Powers Trained.’" Talk. Include 5-minute demonstration on paragraph 7. Teenage daughter asks her father if she can attend cousin’s wedding, to be held in a church.Asks if Society would approve. Suggests father call or write. Father helps her see it is Jehovah’s approval we want. Society has already given guidelines. Gets 1971-1975 Index. Subject "Weddings, attending worldly" refers to December 15, 1974, Watchtower, pages 766-7. Asks her to read the material and later tell him if she still wants to attend. Speaker concludes with comments on value of TheWatchtower. Help our neighbors see value of subscribing during November. One-minute closing scene where daughter comments that Society does not say can’t go, but after seeing all dangers involved has decided not to go.

Nevada-

Warlock

One-minute closing scene where daughter comments that Society does not say can’t go, but after seeing all dangers involved has decided not to go.

So then, AS USUAL, it's the Society's conscience, not yours!

Warlock

Open mind

Hey thanks Atlantis.

Any more opinions out there B4 this thread goes the way of the Dodo Bird?

In particular, any thoughts on how hard the elders would come down on this if at all?

Open Mind

jgnat

You've got it right, Open Mind. The 1970 QFR followed by the 1974 demonstration about sums up the various reactions I've seen from Witnesses when they are faced with a Church wedding.

I believe the American Military's response to the gay question would apply here: "Don't ask, don't tell."

restrangled

So, I'm thinking my wife and I have blown this recital thing way out of proportion.

When I've made choices about raising my sons, I have never once asked myself "What would JW's think?".

I have also never asked "What would my neighbors think?"

It is an utterly foreign idea to me that makes little practical sense.

From the outside looking in, it appears that you are motivated by how others will view you, therefore the decision about whether to let your son play in the recital or not, is completely self serving in nature and has little to do with the welfare of your son.

I don't mean to sound harsh or critical of you...I'm just saying that you should check your motives.

His recital shouldn't be about you, it's should be about him.

I hope you go and celebrate his talent and tell everyone else to F off.

r's hubby

Open mind

UPDATE: We've decided to allow our son to do the recital. We're just not going to shout it from the rooftops. "Don't ask, don't tell".

Restrangled's Hubby said:

From the outside looking in, it appears that you are motivated by how others will view you, therefore the decision about whether to let your son play in the recital or not, is completely self serving in nature and has little to do with the welfare of your son.
I don't mean to sound harsh or critical of you...I'm just saying that you should check your motives.
His recital shouldn't be about you, it's should be about him.

Thanks for adding your voice of sanity and reason to my bizarro world. If I've got it right, you were never a dub right? Without having lived as a dub, you probably can't fully comprehend just how spot on these words of yours are: "you are motivated by how others will view you". In the dub world, it's all about appearances. Especially if you have "privileges" and care about your "reputation".

Anyway, I'm personally past caring about appearances, but I have to still mentally play the game as I try getting my loyal-dub wife and kids out of the Borg. I could care less about "appearances" personally, but I don't want to unnecessarily send up warning signs to my wife that I'm falling away. It's a balancing act and not much fun.

As for this whole recital thing, I think it was "played" just right. My son will hopefully look back on this and remember that Mom & Dad finally let him do something he really loves but that it was "touch & go" for a while due to stupid, nosy, controlling, Borg influence. I know it's sad that my son's happiness is being used as a pawn here, but I've got to think big picture too. This recital is nothing compared to the "Baptism vs. some amount of shunning" decision that will inevitably confront each of my kids.

Open Mind

Kudra

"After seeing all the DANGERS involved"???

GIVE me an f*ckin break.

undercover

I was recently invited to a wedding of a non-JW relative. The wedding is in one of the biggest churches in town. I filled out the RSVP and marked that we would be attending.

Later when talking to some of my JW relatives I asked if they were going and everyone of them said no, because the wedding was in a church. The hypocritical part was that originally the wedding was going to be outside and all my dub relatives were looking forward to it. As soon as it was moved inside the house of Christendom, they all backed out.

Another hypocritical thing, in my perspective anyway, is that many of our non-JW relatives have attended weddings and funerals at the Kingdom Hall without balking. But as soon as one of them plan a wedding in a church, all the JW relatives get holier than thou and refuse to attend.

I am looking forward to representing my family as the only one willing to attend. I'm sure I'll catch hell later, but I'm looking forward to that as well.

Help needed: Dubs doing ANYTHING inside a Church. Borg policy?

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