I have this friend who needs some advice...

by Hmmm 14 Replies latest jw experiences

  • Hmmm
    Hmmm

    I have a friend named uhhh... Timmm, who is in a bit of a quandary.

    He has decided to go public with his apostate leanings, because it is becoming too hard to play the role of a meek, spiritually weak Witness--complete with looks of pity and concern from his mother and siblings, and contempt from his sister-in-law.

    Timmm is sure one brother will have nothing to do with him after this, and he can live with that. Hes not positive what his mother and sisters will do. If they decide to shun him, it will make it very difficult for him to assist them, but he'll do what he has to [edit].

    This is his dilemma: He doesnt know if he should try to get the rest of his family out. Hes a 3 rd generation dub, and wont even bother with extended family, but:

    His father has been bed-ridden for the past few years with a degenerative debilitating disease. Because of his work schedule, Timmm's father never seemed all that strongly indoctrinated, but does his father look to the new system to heal him? Also, he seems to enjoy the occasional (every few months) visits from the brothers at the hall where Timmm's mother and sisters attend. These visits will probably peter off anyway, because Timmm's brother just moved from that hall, and they'll probably become one of those quiet familes that fall through the cracks. Would dad be crushed to learn that there is no panacea on the horizon? What else is there to offer him?

    Timmm's father worked long hours on the midnight shift all during his childhood, so father and sons have never been all that close. Possibly because of that, the other two sons rarely visit. Timmm stops by to cut the grass and say a quick hello, but he's also busy trying to catch up on all the years he threw away on the Watchtower altar, and doesn't visit nearly as often as he should. Dad must be incredibly lonely, and Timmm worries that the disappointment of learning that the New System is not around the bend might push him over the edge into despair.

    Timmm's sisters both have learning disabilities, and live at home with their parents. They are both extremely trusting, and have been taken advantage of by worldly people countless times. They're virtual prisoners in their own home. Their only social outlet is people at the hall. Yes, Witnesses can and do take advantage of people, too, but they do enjoy a measure of sheltering in the congregation that they need. What would happen to them if the family stopped attending?

    Last but not least is Timmm's mother. She grew up in a dysfunctional Witness family and has deep emotional scars from her childhood. She also has a great burden taking care of a sick husband and two daughters. She has a lot of baggage that she carries around, and she feels that nobody understands her. Because of this, she has the worlds biggest persecution/martyr complex. She is not a strong woman on the outside, and takes anti-depressants (but shes far stronger than she'll ever realize). The problem is that Timmm and I can only see this problem getting worse as time goes on and the society keeps pushing the date of her relief back.

    She has never been strong in the truth but has started attending more frequently in the past few years--ironically, she started going more as Timmm started going less. He suspects that much of her depression is a result of squelching doubts and disappointments of WT prophecies past, and he worries that her walls will come crumbling down around her if she loses all hope of a release from her present-day drudgery. Will she pack it in and leave all her responsibilities behind (she would have divorced years ago if it weren't forbidden) for a chance to live her own life in her twilight years? If so--and I think Timmm is a selfish bastard for even thinking this--will the responsibility fall an Timmm, as it always has, to take care of his father and sisters single-handedly?

    Many people say that if you want to get loved ones out of this group, you have to give them something to take its place, but Timmm has nothing to offer. He wiped his theology slate clean years ago, and still has neither the time nor inclination to research and decide if he even believes in God (capitalized just in case), so he wouldn't feel comfortable offering a different religion or belief system as an alternative to the JWs. Because of their physical/mental/emotional handicaps, hobbies outside the home, beyond the bowling league that the women-folk belong to, are pretty much ruled out. His mother is too fragile even to come to this site!

    This is so distressing to Timmm that its making his hair fall out! (At least thats the excuse he uses... I dont believe it.)

    What do you guys think? Will he cause more harm than good if he tells his family the truth about the truth?

    Hmmm

    [edited because Word ate my formatting]

    Edited by - hmmm on 23 July 2002 12:52:23

  • Flip
    Flip
    This is so distressing to Timmm that its making his hair fall out!

    There may be the possibility that Timmm might have to begin to understand that his family is exhibiting or is affected by addictive, dysfunctional behavior similar to alcoholics and are so far gone there may be nothing he could do or say to save them from their plight, except seek professional counsel to extricate himself from their destructive cycle and save himself.

    Edited by - Flip on 22 July 2002 20:23:32

  • dungbeetle
    dungbeetle

    <There may be the possibility that Timmm might have to begin to understand that his family is exhibiting or is affected by addictive, dysfunctional behavior similar to alcoholics and are so far gone there may be nothing he could do or say to save them from their plight, except seek professional council to extricate himselffrom their destructive cycle and savehimself.>

    YEAH!!!

  • teejay
    teejay

    >> What do you guys think? Will he cause more harm than good if he tells his family the truth about the truth?

    In my opinion, YES, Timmm will do more harm than good.

    p.s. I *will* return with a more detailed response. I had to cut and paste to a Word document (Simon's default is too small for me to comfortably read!!! Dammit!!!!!!!!!).

    For what it's worth, tell Timmmm that my heart goes out to him and his family. I mean that. The heartache and harm that the WTS-experience we have all endured is almost unbearable at times. Here's to us.

  • teejay
    teejay

    Hmmm,

    I have been favored (cursed?) with a healthy dose of the martyr complex myself, I'm afraid. I read a book not long ago -- Alex Haley's Mama Flora's Family -- that more or less whispered something to me a truth I've always believed: that it's okay to sacrifice your life and happiness for the sake of building a better life for your loved ones. It's okay. But said sacrifice must hit the mark. It must not be wasted.

    In my opinion, based on the little that you've shared here, nothing of value would be accomplished by either revealing (or attempting to reveal) the dark underbelly of the WTS to your family. NOTHING.

    Without meaning or trying to get too metaphysical or overly philosophical, I believe that life is a ruse, a trick... like the kiddie song we all sang of row, row, row your boat / gently down the stream / merrily, merrily, merrily / life is but a dream.

    I believe there's more than just a bit of truth in that song. Yeah, maybe I'm a fool, but I believe that. "Life is but a dream." It is.

    Since that *IS*, why wake up your family from their dream? How could a son, even if his art of persuasion was keen enough and his methodology smooth enough, find *ANY* comfort in telling his dying father that, "well, dad, you've been rooked all these years. Sorry you wasted your life... missed out. But, at least you know the "truth" now."

    Why would he tell his mother who was/is equally deluded? His sisters, who are not able to fully care for themselves?

    I posted once last year about a Witness that I see on my job -- a man I see only in passing. Every time I see him, he makes me think of the JW experience. MY JW experience. Not just the life -- the things he does that are peculiar to that life -- but the mentality of it... what goes on in your head. What you think and believe. How your mind works.

    So, I'd ask Timmm:

    What would be your point? To win some sort of moral victory? That you are right and they are fools? That they are wrong?

    I tell you... I will willingly lose those sorts of battles with my family. Every one.

    "Okay", I say. "You're right," even when I know they are wrong.

    But you know what? We spend time together, me and my family, and it's all good. "Be deluded," I'm thinking the whole time. "Dream your dream." (I'm sure in hell am dreaming mine.)

    Hell... aren't we ALL?

    ___________
    I wish I knew Timmm's number. I'd think about giving the man a call...

  • outoftheorg
    outoftheorg

    I think Flip and Teejay said it all.

    I have nothing to add.

    I could have done better of course ha ha.

  • yrs2long
    yrs2long

    If the worst-case scenario occurred how would Timmm fare? Would he be okay? Would he be able to live a productive life if his worst fears in connection with his family were realized? Will Timmm be okay at the end of his days to have dedicated his life to looking after the family?

  • minimus
    minimus

    TIMMMM should really do what HE is comfortable with.Maybe he needs to ease into things a little at a time. Whatever he does, there will be repercussions.He has to be prepared for whatever decision he makes.....I don't envy him.

  • Farkel
    Farkel

    I'm with teejay on this one, Hmmm. Some people just aren't strong enough to handle the truth. Timmm should at the very most wait for a better opportunity.

    Farkel

  • Imbue
    Imbue

    If it does the individual good to stay in the org then why rock their world!

    These are some questions he may ask himself about the situation.

    Is it harming these individuals to remain and how so?

    Are they having difficulties as a result of their dysfunctional relationship with the WT?

    Would they consider seeking treatment for co-dependency and/or other related psychological issues?

    Are these individuals capable of living in reality without suffering from depression and frustration.

    Some of us are realists and some live in the dub concept of reality. I believe most apostates are realists and dubs for life are not capable of living in reality.

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