I received this through e-mail on another forum "PioneerOutreach". Fascinating, horrible, reading. It's long - but guaranteed to leave you thinking "what the ........"
So many issues involved - and tossed aside. Btw, I've added the bold.
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Dear ALL,
With all the talk about how horriably some husbands act I wanted to share with you an experience that I just heard, from a JW who is on a JW list Im on. This is by far one of the saddest, and infuriating experience I have heard in my life....
PLease read this.....and please keep in mind that this woman is still in the org relying on it to help her, But I wanted to share it with you none the less
Here goes.............................
Have you had your 2001 District Convention yet? Mine was back in June. I can assure you that much of the infomation learned from that DC has helped me greatly to feel that I did do the right thing for my circumstances...it's taken an emmense weight off my shoulders and planted it squarely on those of my now ex-husband when and if he ever wants to get help for himself.
Please realize that what I'm about to tell you may fit your situation...or it may not. There could be things that aren't mentioned that do have an impact. So, in other words, don't read this and think this is what you should do or have to do or anything like that. Take it as information of relevant material that you need to digest yourself and pray for Jehovah's direction on.
We've had troubles (undefined) for many years. I mistakenly fell into his way of thinking...that as long as I did things that pleased my husband (regardless of how I personally felt about such things) then I was pleasing Jehovah and being a wife true to the scriptural definition.
Ex first got on the internet around 1990 related to his job. He'd talk about it when he got home and always want to someday get online at home. Our troubles increased greatly then...but I related it to my very complicated pregnancy in 91 that ended on 12/31/91 with the birth of triplets...which led to a full year of sleep deprivation, overworked mommy, frustrated and acting out older siblings of triplets and Ex working more and more hours. I totally accepted the blame then.
By this point, Ex never made any meetings without me...and I rarely managed it...all he had to do was get up (his life then was work/sleep/work/sleep) and get himself ready...while I had to get myself ready, get six kids ready, get whatever meeting materials needed ready, get all the kids in the car...then he'd be upset that we were running late! Sometimes so mad he would not go at all...and would not allow me to take the car.
OK...you've got *some* background...now fast forward...1994 we moved from TX to WI (1200 miles) to be of help to his elderly, widowed mom who lived in a really small town (change from 2mil.pop metropolis to a 7k pop. rural town)! At first employment was very iffy...very unstable...then in 1995 (almost a full from when we moved here) he got work with the school district here. He revolutionized the computer technology department! The state is even using his work as an example for other school districts to follow!
*He is excellent in his field...knows how to deal with computers far more than people* You'd think with the stable job, getting into our own place (we'd lived w/grandma for awhile), and settling in some that things should begin to improve...at least that's what I thought. When they didn't, again I took the blame...he said it was my fault...over and over...and I dutifully looked to him to know more than me and especially so spiritually since he had been a pioneer and a ministerial servant looking to be an elder...and looked up to
by so many of the brothers and sisters. But they didn't know what went on at home, or anywhere, when they weren't around.
When I repeatedly *surprised* him, catching him viewing a porn site online on our home computer I always inquired about it, trying not to sound like a nag, but needing to why he kept going to these sites. At first he'd say he didn't realize the link he'd clicked went to a porn site. Later he'd say that it was part of his job, which at first I just accepted, but later pushed for more reasons, he'd explain that he needed to confirm what type of site it was b/c a kid at school was logged as having visited the url and was denying that
it was porn. I never really understood why he didn't then just do that at work...trying to get much more from him only got him angry. Ex being angry...was becoming more common...and was something we all tried to really avoid. He was always saying he's sorry...sorry he got mad enough to bruise someone...sorry he was so angry...sorry he demanded so much...but it never stopped him.
March 1998 - at this point I'd been privately working with an elder and his wife to gain my own scriptural understanding of some things...trying to do so without calling blame on my husband...but ultimately that's where it led. I tried applying my new-found knowledge (after learning he had totally misled me) and get him to see that what he was doing was not only upsetting our family...hurting us in ways we didn't even yet know...but what he was doing was scripturally wrong...it was wrong in Jehovah's eyes any way you looked at it...there was no rationalizing it to be good! The end result of this took us to a physical altercation witnessed by our two youngest children (then 6 yrs old) who both cried and begged daddy to stop hurting mommy. It came to a point that I could no longer feel my hands (he'd squeezed my wrists so tightly, he cut of the circulation) that I was given to pray for Jehovah's help to stop this, and then found the strength to get him off of me...which
angered him more...but to the point that he stormed out the front door, slamming it behind him. At that point I hoped he'd never come back! But he did several hours later, just at dinnertime. He made fun of the pain I said I was in. He refused to see that what happened that day was any fault of his. The next several days were extremely tense...and I only got thru them with prayer and confidence that Jehovah would help me.
Ultimately...the sheriff escorted him out, the judge said the restraining order would be for the maximum time (2 yrs) and able to be renewed for another 2 if he violated it just once. He violated it dozens of times...most of which the police or sheriff let slide.
During meetings with the elders over the next few months...he at first denied doing anything to hurt me (even while both arms/hands are in braces)...weeks later he did finally admit to it...but also said it was my fault that he did it. As time passed we heard him admit to liking to go to the porn sites (had been since TX), sometimes being excessively angry and physically rough with
his family (but again blamed something I did to deserve that or to make him feel that way with the kids).
When my oldest daughter came forward about some things he did to her...often the reasons they'd get into fights...and scripturally along the lines of incestuous loose conduct...he completely denied all her allegations, saying that I put her up to it just to keep him out of the house. In court later, he lied repeatedly, tried to say I never did any education of the 5 kids I homeschooled; that I purposely caused them to have their many illnesses and/or developmental delays, seizures, apraxias, apneas, asthma attacks, etc., etc., etc. Things were so strained...that the CO & the DO along with the elders here notified the brothers in New York, who replied with the recommendation that one of us (him preferrably) attend a different congregation while the court proceeding were going on.
Ex strongly, emphatically, refused! He said no one had the right to tell him where to go to meetings, even the F&DS! I tried attending elsewhere (30 miles away) but with six kids and all of us with various health problems and disabilities...it was extremely hard...and the elders requested that I return here...and they'd work at keeping problems at meetings to a minimum.
He's still in *good standing* and all the court stuff is over....Jehovah has sustained me and my children (we've never not had the necessities, no matter how many times Ex tried to make it so) . My oldest daughter has left the truth because of this (she feels as tho the elders, cong. & even Jehovah must think Ex did no wrong because he was not in any way punished, except for me not taking him back in). The others have their doubtful moments...but they are slowly seeing the Truth of all matters.
Recently, Ex's long-time contract with our school district was not renewed (circumstances around that are interesting...as much of his own doing as it was those that wanted to get him out) My mom said 'It seems as Jehovah has made a way to have his earlier intentions of Ex attending a different hall come to happen!' Ex found a similar position in a school district about 200 miles away! This will be something different for my kids....dad won't be
'dropping in' all the time and in some casing mortifying them to extreme embarrassment in front of the other kids at school (of course dad never saw it this way).
Since the DC here, many of the friends that seemed to avoid me and my kids like the plague are coming up with apologies and understanding and support!
It's horrible to hear that what I went thru, what my kids went thru, and what we all had to deal with here...is something happening all over...Many, many husbands in the Truth are dealing with their wives and families in a Treacherous way...and we all must learn how to change this...by applying the scriptures properly and making sure in what we learn before we become teachers of others.
Sara, I hope this helps you. I know when I was in the *thick* of it, Jehovah gave me a few sisters online to assist me and help me remain strong for the Truth and all of Jehovah's ways. I'm here for you...if you need me. We are given trials that we may learn from them and teach others...all to Jehovah's glory! In this we will know with greater certainty that if the New System does not come soon, none of us shall survive!
Agape & Philia,
An
NOW HERE IS MY RESPONSE TO HER.........
Dearset An,
I am both saddened and horrofied after reading your experiences with your EX.
How horriable!!! I have so many things I would like to say, but Im going to restrict them to a few questions that I hope you wont mind answering.
First and for most.... Why is this man still in "good standing"?? why wasnt he disfellowshipped?Why in the world is this man not in jail???????? AND you mentioned that there were those friends who avoided you like the plague...why did they do so???
How old are your children now?
I'll continue this post when I calm down...
Much love..
LM
HER RESPONSE WAS HEART WRENCHING....... READ ON....
LM,
It is sad...and was horrifying...tho now I am not so emotional about
it...Jehovah gives me exactly the help I need as it's needed. :)
Regarding your questions: (and no, I don't mind answering)
1. Why is he still in "good standing" and why wasn't he disfellowshipped? Sometimes this is really hard on me. I finally (a long time back) had to meet with the CO and the local elders and step by step go over this with them. At times I felt like a little kid...with all my questions...about every little thing. LOL
The first consideration is the fact that much of what he did was done at times when it was only him and the other person...no other witnesses. For any judicial action, there must be a third person in cases where two are saying opposing accounts of the same event...in other words, someone else must have witnessed what happened so it can be validated. IF he had just come forward and admitted to the wrongdoings, then the elders would have met privately with him to address the consequences. Disfellowshipping will not be done, even for the most heinous of wrongdoing, IF the wrongdoer is truly
repentant and asks for forgiveness. When my Ex finally came around to admitting SOME of his wrongdoings he WAS ACTING very sorry about it and BEGGING for forgiveness. And the elders asked me if he had asked for my forgiveness. For each circumstance, I could forgive what he admitted to. But forgiving those, until he admitted to what my daughter said he did, I cannot believe that it is safe to live with him again nor even maintain a 'friendly' sort of relationship. In my mind, based on what she has described, I believe we are scripturally divorced. The fact that it remains
unproven (either way - we can't prove he did it, & he can't prove he didn't do it) does not make me believe otherwise.
Sometimes I felt like maybe the elders believed him and maybe were trying to convince me to allow him to come back home. After much prayer, I met with the elders and expressed this concern. They even admitted, aside from their elder status, they did each have concerns regarding 'who' was telling the truth...so they were carefully going by the book with this matter. Later, again after much prayer, I met with them again and made them aware of some unusual specific happenings that I believed were directed only by Jehovah's hand (so to speak), there just wasn't any other explanation for it(them).
Since that time, there has been a more careful watch on me that I get all the spiritual food possible, and all the spiritual care needed at a given time. And as that has increased, Ex's problems seem to increase as well. I believe he knows that the stronger I am spiritually, the less chance there is that he will be a part of my life. He doesn't understand fully that Jehovah must be first for each of us. He feels the wife should put her husband first and the
husband must provide for his family first. LOL that's why I like my *job* as a Mary Kay consultant (very part time still) because the whole company believes and acts accordingly, that you must make God First, Family Second, and Work/Job Third if you are to be successful! When Jehovah is first, it's so easy to see how and why it works best that way! Ex is a long way from that.
2. Why is he not in jail?
No one was ever able to PROVE that he did what he was accused of doing. It seems insane...but he was very convincing, and still is! I was raised in the Truth...and he managed to trick me for many years. It was wrong of me to allow him to change my bible trained conscience just because I believed that his being a pioneer and a ministerial servant made him more knowledgeable and more capable than I would ever be. He was misleading me very slowly...I didn't realize how bad it was until we'd been married some 18 years! And I still remember the look on the CO's face when I told him that it was because of many points he made, repeatedly, during one of his recent visits...one of the few in years that I was able to make every single congregation meeting and at least one meeting for service each day...because of these points, I began earnestly investigating all the various "trouble spots" I KNEW of then. (The CO said he'd never had anyone tell him that one of his talks led them to separating from their mate before! And then he added that he hoped that wouldn't be something he became known for. LOL) That led to a deeper and deeper investigation. Unfortunately, it made things worse at home. As I
tried to incorporate my revised accurate knowledge, Ex got angrier and more volatile...and the more I learned and tried to apply...the worse he got. In some ways for me, that time felt like I was learning the Truth all over again. Even when I could show him all the scriptures and various WT or other pubs comments on it validating my point and my understanding...he'd say I was misinterpreting it. The elders were great about it tho...I'd beg them not to come and do a shepherding call and bring these particular points out because
then he'd end up taking it out on me later...accusing me of setting him up or purposely having them talk about that subject to teach him a lesson he didn't need! They tried to believe he wouldn't be that way...but were watchful when they hinted of such things and then they'd drop it and mov!e on to something else, and then they'd find a way to work it into a part at the meetings...sadly, he missed most of those.
But I'm getting side-tracked. Legally speaking, he's not in jail because me and my six kids did not have any kind of record of what he did...it was like a "he said - she said" sort of thing. Neither side could prove our statements. Now, I advise all women, sisters or not, but especially sisters, to create a paper trail of the treacherous abuse by using the police, the courts, family services, children's protective services, elders if possible, and others outside your own family...without it, there is little to back you up when you really need it...with it, maybe he'll see what he's doing wrong and work at changing before serious, permanent damage has been done.
You'd think with the 7 of us saying pretty much the same thing against the 1 of him...that should count for something. Ex first worked to discredit our children's 'testimony' of the events by saying that I put them up to it. For the 2 young witnesses of my altercation w/him...he accused me of lying about what they were supposedly saying - both girls have serious speech problems and back then very few people could translate their speech into normal English - I, being their mother and primary caretaker, did this best.
But he claimed what he understood them to say was nothing close to what I was saying they said. When it came to my older kids...he claimed that they were each very rebellious and were opposing the Truth so they would be capable of lying just to keep him out of their lives. He also claimed that I was the one giving them these awful ideas of what he'd done to them.
This, I think, was a great factor in my oldest leaving the Truth...the fact that when he'd do what he'd done he'd threaten her that something bad would happen if she let anyone know about this...and then he publicly said she was lying, she was mentally unstable because of me, or was just trying to get even with him for something like not allowing her to stay out after 9 or something. I remember back when she first told me about what had been going on between them...she said maybe dad should have insisted she be homeschooled (we began homeschooling with only the kids that wanted it at first - that was his idea too) because if I was homeschooling her she would not have had a high school health course that included subjects related to abuse and incest and was very explicit about the entire procreative processes (and I remember worrying about her taking that particular course) and THAT's when she realized that what "daddy was doing with daddy's special girl" was wrong even by worldly standards! She said he'd been doing "stuff" since as far as she could remember. He was careful to not leave any outward signs. All of her 'yeast infections' and urinary tract infections were from all the antibiotics she had been on (that was a lot, for many years too), so we thought then. Her odd behavior around other males was just shyness.
By the time any court was involved...or any children's protective
service...he was out of the house, there was no recent incidents that might possibly give us evidence...and he pretty much destroyed her credibility with his lies. She even tried going public - she used a free discussion time in one class...where the topic lead to women hating men that abuse them...to openly describe what her dad had done to her and others in our family! The teacher felt it was something she was mandated to report. The administration threatened her with her job and her grade (as a student teacher) and recommendation...she backed down and told us reporting was up to admin.
Well, Ex worked for the school...he WAS admin!
The concensus was to stick by him and his side of the story, so much so that they threatened to expell my daughter if she ever mentioned anything like this at school again! (so much for teaching kids that it's safe to report abuse to a teacher) Nearly everyone I've spoke to holds the fear that getting on his wrong side means major computer problems for each of them individually. That is now even part of the reason he's lost that job just this past month.There was one last chance to make known what he'd done...the irony is that HIS Actions against me actually lead to the situation that made me "settle" with the custody case. My attorney had advised us to keep much of the abusive situation specifics quiet until they were needed in court. We were up against a notorious attorney (the kind attorneys would pay for if they wanted to get away with something they knew was wrong) and didn't want to give her a chance to have anything ready to respond in defense.
We were just a few weeks away from the trial dates (judge set TWO days to hold this trial - he described it as the worst divorce/custody case ever in the county) when I became very ill. Ended up being caused by the pain meds I'd been taking...constantly trying different ones ever since I was hurt in Mar 98 by him. My health was so fragile at that point that we had a meeting (me, my docs, & my attorney...and then even the kids' counselors) and it was decided that going to trial meant risking my collapse in court and then the judge would be likely to place the kids with dad, at least until I was well enough to work and care for them again. So we settled.
For the first time in almost 3 years he got to keep the kids overnight...gradually increasing to periods of up to a full week. This was so hard for me...and them...the counselors believed the kids and were ready to say so in court...the attorney was ready to help me go thru each year of our marriage enumerating specific abusive times...and the docs were doing their darnedest to help me get well enough for this. When I told the kids...with the counselors...during one of their appointments...they all cried...the oldest got very, very angry...we had a lot to work thru before those visits would begin.
Thankfully the judge agreed to all the "watchpoints" the counselors wanted in place. While Ex does see, now, 3 of the kids, overnights without any real supervision...there is plenty of support for the kids to discuss those visits freely and the counselors get dad in on things better than anyone else ever could and they are doing their best to get him to see the error of his ways. So far, so good. But there was something happening that was troubling the 2 girls, and something different bothering my son; related to visits somehow...now those visits will only be on weekends...and overnights only every other weekend... because Ex lives 200 miles away during the weekdays.
Add the fact that his brother, whom he was living with (was w/mom & brother, but mom died 2/99) here in town, has had to step back from being an elder due to something related to what was going on in his house. I think the uncle is watching out more now when the kids are there with dad. In some ways Ex is being a better dad to these 3 kids than he ever was to the older three...that's both good and bad.
3. those friends who avoided you like the plague....???
Why? probably due to hearing only ex's side via his brother-the-elder and added to the fact that I quietly left to attend elsewhere for a number of months. They never knew the why's and wherefore's of that course.
Appropriately so, only the elders (minus brother-the-elder) knew the details of my 'disappearance', they and the elders of the other cong. :) They still don't know the details much, but many have realized that I and my kids have lived what the brothers were talking about at the convention...we have been cared for in a very treacherous way by a man who still believes he only did what Jehovah wanted him to do, who tells others he's one of Jehovah's Witnesses, and who deceives everyone, including himself.
4. How old are your children now?
Now...19, 16, 13, 9, 9, & 9. Then...15, 12, 9, 6, 6, & 6. The 9 yr olds will be 10 soon.
Whew....I've written so much...and given you so much to read..LOL...It's good for me...and maybe it will help another sister endure a similar situation. Jehovah keeps me and my kids always with all we need. There are things in these last 4 years that are truly wondrous miracles! Sometimes I don't like being a single parent. Sometimes I think maybe Ex has really changed. And always when I feel low over these things, Jehovah finds a way to reassure me and remind of my own personal vow, and then I am strong and happy again. Only HE knows what must happen for me to fully believe in my Ex again and feel he is someone safe to live with again...so I know Jehovah will help to see when that time is...if ever.
There are daily reminders of what Ex has done...my kidneys are still in poor shape and we're fighting with whatever seems apropriate...since that was diagnosed, I've been also diagnosed with Severe Fibromyalgia probably triggered by Ex's assault on me, and we have noticed a very tiny improvement in the nerves damaged in my wrists...just not enough to think I'd have full use back any time soon, just the slight hope that it may not be permanent as we thought before. I've applied for government disability assistance and I'm
in the process of finding a new home/apt/house/etc without stairs to climb, and with everything set up so it's easier for me to tend to my own needs and those of my children. The kids are learning to be more independent and do many of the daily chores without my help. Soon I hope to have one of my older girls driving so I won't need to do as much of it myself. I'm in various therapies or exercise programs to attempt to keep my body working it's best. It does get very discouraging to lose abilities that you are so used to doing on your own. But again, Jehovah keeps me in good spirits often enough the bad times don't last so long.
While a part of me longs to see the New System ASAP...another part hopes it holds back just enough to get my daughter back, and possibly enough to get my Ex to finally see the Truth too.
Sisters, I hope there is some benefit to reading all this for you. I thank you for 'listening' and I'm for any of you, if there is any way I can be of help.
Agape & Philia,
An
Dear true friends..IT SICKENS ME TO HEAR SUCH HORRIFIC
SITUATIONS HAPPENING..And even after ALLLLL she has explained....she still has this glimmer of hope that her EX will REPENT and they would be reunited...!!!!!! How is it that this man was never disfellowshipped? How is it that those in the congregation can still look at him as a fine example and yet treat her and her kids as if
they had the plauge?? THIS IS SUPPOSED TO BE THE TRUE RELIGION?????
Im sorry for laying all this on you but Im sicken to the core with how so much crap is going on... child molestation goes on because there were no witnesses.?? wives and children being beated and everyone looks the other way?????
What kind of barbarians are these?
Love in truth and freedom,
LM