High Achieving Women

Thirdson

Some of you are aware of my feelings about the role of women in the Christian congregation and know I chose a female priest (and someone who is now a good friend) to conduct Thirdson and Mrs. Thirdson’s wedding.

What got me thinking was yesterday’s review of the results of the "all colleague survey" with my manager when we discussed where we as department were doing well and where we needed improvement. My boss scored an approval rating of over 85% on nearly every topic. She is one of the best bosses I have ever worked for and her style of management is very similar to mine -- which probably accounts for a great deal. Her boss is also female. In fact in the last 10 years I have nearly always reported to women as either a direct report or as a higher level manager.

I work in Information Technology and my bosses (and most of my colleagues) are pretty smart and high achieving people. Many of my colleagues are skilled managers, good teachers, able public speakers and gifted in many other ways. What I thought about today, was how many of these talented and high achieving female colleagues would ever fit in or deem to be part of a religion like Jehovah’s Witnesses? When I thought about it I couldn’t ever remember one Witness sister who was a manager or a high achieving person in the workplace. I knew some talented female Witnesses growing up but those ones (like my sister and my best friend’s sister) aren’t Witnesses today. There are lots of gifted and women on this board who have definite opinions about the treatment of women within the WTS and JWs. How do you feel about the second class treatment you received in the Kingdom Hall compared to the treatment (albeit not equal even today in modern US society) you receive being out? Am I right about the lack of high acheiving women in the JW religion?

Thirdson

Edited for not spelling 'achieve' right!

'To avoid criticism, say nothing, do nothing, be nothing'

blondie

The least qualified, baptized brother (sometimes even unbaptized) will always outrank the most qualified sister.

5/1/72 WT page 271 How Your View of Authority Affects Your Life ***

Somewhat similar to the authority of male over female in marriage, in the Christian congregation the man also has certain authority over the woman. This is sometimes difficult to accept for the woman who has been “emancipated” in modern society. The majority of those in Jehovah’s organization are women, and for them to assent to male authority is a testimony to the way Jehovah’s Word can work. A woman coming into this organization who has a secular job where she has authority over a large number of others, including men, may find it difficult to restrain herself in the presence of a male who is not so able to direct others as she is. However, if she continues to accept her place in Jehovah’s arrangement and see in it His way, she will make a valuable contribution to the peace and harmony of the congregation.—1 Tim. 2:12.

8/1/1962 WT page 463 Role of Wife and Children in a Happy Family ***

Further, many authorities recognize the subservient role of the wife and the helpful position she can occupy toward her husband. Notice what one woman psychologist said recently: “I am a woman, hence my chief interest is men. And because I am also a psychologist, my interest in men is greater than it otherwise would be. Recently the National Management Association asked me to do some research on the different psychological factors of both men and women. It hoped that what I learned might point to ways of reducing the pressures which develop when men and women work together. I saw emerge these two truths: 1. All women like to work under a ceiling of authority. In short, they like to be bossed. 2. All women must feel that they are needed. These truths arise from the fact that, basically, women feel while men think. Women frequently measure up to men and surpass them in intelligence, but they are handicapped by the weight of emotional drag. Men have more practical minds; they can judge, organize, direct. Thus the supervision of women by men seems to be nature’s plan, however desperately women may fight it.” What this authority refers to as nature’s plan we recognize as God’s purpose. How wholesome an arrangement it is and how well it works for happy family circles!

Excuse me now, I have to go vomit!

Thirdson

Blondie,

The attitudes of 1962 are long gone in the work place of successful companies. You'd think the WTS would have changed in the last 40 years. Can a sister even carry the mikes?

Thirdson

'To avoid criticism, say nothing, do nothing, be nothing'

blondie

I heard that in some small out of the way congregations with few brothers, some sisters carry microphones. That is there are only 2 brothers, one reads and one conducts. But I have seen it where the brother conducts and reads while the other brother does the microphones.

Some COs have told the elder body that if there are no qualified brothers other than the elders that the elders will carry the microphones. I was in a congregation where they used a little 9 year old, UNBAPTIZED brother rather than use a sister. Sisters use their talents sometimes behind the scenes when a husband recognizes his wife's abilities and uses them in a way that few can observe.

If women were so unqualified, why did God select them to be rulers in heaven?

Thirdson

Blondie,

I have known sisters write talks for their husbands. One brother had such poor eyesite his wife used to write his talks in big letters on cue cards for him. I guess that was working in the back.

Thirdson

'To avoid criticism, say nothing, do nothing, be nothing'

Tina

(((((3rd)))))))
Hi!
One of my pet issues here. Just wanted to say,I plan on contributing as soon as time allows. I didn't want to see this get buried. Thanks for bringing up what I consider such a relevant issue that any woman involved in fundamental christianity (JW) needs to think about. hugs,T

Vive Bene
Spesso L'amore
Di Risata Molto!!!

Englishman

Blondie,

Thanks for posting that, Her Ladyship teaches sociology to adults here, and it's just the sort of stuff that her students like, so I'm printing it off.

Englishman.

Nostalgia isn't what it used to be....

JT

Well i guess you look at the age of most of the decision makers at bethel for the last 20-40 yrs

they come from a time where that mindset was so implanted

the org is merely a reflection of it's leaders

old school guys - have old school mindsets

james

Pathofthorns

I think the problem lies in that the Bible appears to support the way JWs and most religions have traditionally viewed and treated women. Paul's writings certainly don't help.

The personality of Jesus does stand out in this regard, which has always facinated me. His treatment of women and children ran counter to the culture of the times and he was hundreds and hundreds of years ahead of his time.

Unfortunately, as long as women would like to uphold the Bible, there will always be a large number who willfully sign up to be second-class citizens.

Path

think41self

Hi Thirdson,

You are correct in your assessment of how the society views women...out of one side of their mouth they spout how women are not inferior, husbands should love them as their own bodies...out the other side, they remind them that the man is the one "responsible" for the family and carries that heavy burden of decision making. Women are not allowed "privileges" in the congregation.

How do I view that now? It took me awhile to see it, you see I was raised by a JW mother and a "Southern" father...so equal rights for women was not something I observed at home or the hall. Where I'm at now...I'm not a radical feminist...I'm certainly not a man hater but I have a lot of respect for myself and a healthy amount of self confidence. Therefore I have pretty rigid "boundaries" and no one crosses those...not in my family, my work, my friends. The same degree of respect I have for myself is what I try to uphold with others...and I could never go back to any organization that did not believe in the equality of women.

p.s. After reading Path's comments I have to add...The Woman Hater Paul is a big reason I wouldn't go back to a "Christian" religion either. Just think of the type of men who are attracted to that type of teaching?

think41self

Holy Flying Screaming Buddha, Batman!

High Achieving Women

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