Demons,ghosts,& wierd happenings

by Liberty 4 Replies latest jw friends

  • Liberty
    Liberty

    I love this subject. I just wanted to point out that I am not a complete skeptic about these things I just think that there are many possible explainations besides the standard JW "IT WAS DEMONS" response. Firstly, I'd like to reinterate that I respect the reality of your experiances in the realm of the para-normal so I'm not arguing that you are all lying or that you're crazy, I am merely questioning the cause of the event. Demons(fallen angels) and classic ghosts( as lost souls) just don't make much sense to me as explainations because these strange sightings,noises,and activities seem to usually be confined and limited in ways that a powerful demon or a conscious soul wouldn't be.

    I used the example of why ghosts/demons rarely if ever manifest themselves while we are at work or when we are carrying out our business in public. If the JW-style demons REALLY existed why would these places be off limits? Are they only allowed to haunt us at night in private homes when we are alone or around a few other people? It seems to me that powerful spirit beings would have even fewer limitatons on what they could do than physical beings, not more. So why don't they show up while we are at work or at the World Series stadium during a big game? I joked that maybe they have union rules that restrict the type,times, and locations for harrasing humans but if they are real this seems to be the case. Why don't we ever hear about a guy at work who's filing paperwork when his co-workers notice a floating head chattering behind him or plates of food flying through the air by themselves at busy restaurants full of people? I think there are reasons why wierd things happen when and where they do and that these limitations are clues to the real causes of para-normal activity.

    Ghosts may be recorded and replayed energy trapped in a magnetic field for instance rather than a disembodied soul which may explain why so many ghost repeat the same actions and "haunt" the same places. Poltergeist activity maybe telekinetic powers generated by the human mind rather than an evil spirit. Attacks by unseen beings may be the result of a brain malfunction or a dream state. and on and on. I'm just saying that it's a big Universe out there and that alot of explainations are alot more probable than naughty angels on a rampage. Just food for thought. Keep those wierd and scarey stories coming cause they are interesting and just plain fun.
    Liberty

  • Fredhall
    Fredhall

    Liberty,

    If you want to see some pictures of real ghosts, and demons, then go to Beacon Light for Ex-jws.

  • think41self
    think41self

    Liberty,

    I'm with you. I think there are many possible answers to why these experiences happen. And your point is good, if it were demons, don't you think they would be having a lot more fun with people, and making big splashes...kind of like in the ghostbuster's movies!

    I for one am keeping an open mind, one which is not afraid to analyze things, even strange and unusual things. Like how the hell does Fred Hall manage to read, or even type, with his head up his ass like that? We've all been enjoying your family pics that TR and Slayer have been posting. Hope you send them some more

    think41self

  • unclebruce
    unclebruce

    G'day Liberty,

    I don't believe in demons but some of my closest (intelligent, down to earth, not the least bit religious) friends assure me external dark forces exist. (I say 'outside' because I believe in the posibility of us creating some kinda black aura (tibetan style) from our own internal darkness) Some things are as yet unexplained and it's great to be free of religious and scientific dogmatism so as to enjoy things mysterious for what they are. Either way lifes journey is enhansed by an open enquiring mind.

    Though scientists have come a long way in this field I believe it will take a few hundred more years before the bottom of all this is reached and/or the general public ready for the answers.

    Just as the hard sciences evolved from esoteric mystic beginings, so it is with this. (a few short years ago, who'd have thunk dentists would be using hynotherapy, or herbal medicines accepted by mainsteam medicos or a little further back, electricity is real)

    To those sceptics ignorant of these things I'd sugest seriously researching in the field of the paranormal before shooting your mouths off. I have had a good deal of experience in this field from being a JW demon fighter, laughing at the ancient Romans and their lightning throwing God Jove, while extolling the virtues of my lightning throwing God Jehovah to a complete sceptic to experiencing a heap of strange stuff, from flying saucages to haunted board games. Nearly everyone I know has had paranormal experiences of one sort or another and many, like most of mine, have multiple witnesses. Ghostly apparitions do appear at places of work and during the day although night seems to be the popular time for spooks, perhaps the suns powerful magnetic field interferes with their power. I have a book somewhere of ghosts in Sydney - suburb by suburb. It is amazing when one brings up the subject of ghosts how common they are. One of my friends lives in an old house with two female ghosts, when he argues with his wife one of them gets angry and starts attacking her (she's Latvian and the ghost is aussie so there's probably some racism involved - who want's a Slavic woman taking over their house? ;)

    This is a field worthy of further investigation by any one curious but I think some groundwork in human psyciatry and basic physics is necessary to distinguish illusion and imagination from the genuine phenonomen. In England serious open scientific work on this has been carried out for well over 100 years. I can't remember the name of the Journal where the investigations and findings are published. (my books are locked away)

    When I get time I'd like to relate some of the things that bought me out of the darkness of arrogant sceptisism and into the bright lights of knowing fuck all ;)

    spookybruce, frustrated by old man time and bumps in the night.

    PS: I find it amusing and deridable that those most often knocking the existence of ghosts have never even seen one. ;)

    PSS: I'm glad you put up this clarifying thread you were comming over a bit silly like the UFO scoffers the other day. Ignorance is sooo ugly

  • ttwho
    ttwho

    thought I'd give my 2 cents, I wrote this to randy walters last year

    Dear Randall

    I have a lot to say but won't bore with the details, a brief introduction would be appropriate. I suffered with depression for great part if my teenage life and so when I listened to the JWs I embraced it with open arms, in about a year of studying I was baptised. Like so many I had no idea of the life to come, I have so much to say most of which you know or have heard from other JWs. Despite all that has happen there is something that still plagues me even 21/2 year after leaving.

    I was raised with a belief in a god, I had a little knowledge of the angels and the demons, and in the year that I started studying I was awoken with the strange sensation that I was being choked! similar to being in a headlock. I chalked this down to a demon attack and my study conductor comforted me with the notion that god would protect me and that all I have to do have call out his name and everything would all right and the demon would not come back. Some time after, I moved house and became a member of the local congregation. It wasn't long before I was attacked in my sleep, the pain is EXCRUCIATING (I use the word 'is' because it still happens). I said nothing to anybody out of fear, I guess I blamed myself, I thought, well, I'm in god's true organisation, so I must be the weak link. So I all but stopped watching TV and stopped listening to music for fear that I was allowing them in somehow. My mother was 7th day Adventist and you may know, they don't believe in images so that ruled her out. Later on I got the chance to go to Florida with a brother who had a fleshly brother out there. I was also attacked in my sleep there. The following year I went back,(having fallen in love with America), this time I stayed with an elder and his family and again I was attacked, while sleeping in his daughters bed. The following year I went back to the states and the same thing happened again at another brother's house. It destroyed my faith in a god who is concerned with us personally. I remember a night when the ordeal was so traumatic that on the way to work to work I cried thinking of the reasons why god would let this happen to someone that supposedly had given is life to him. What was perplexing was that the bible says that 'you won't be tested more than you can bear' that god 'will always make a way out for you', sickness or illness I can understand, temptation from the opposite sex to fornicate, temptation to steal or lie I can understand, but asleep in your bed!!! Where's my way out?? The attacks makes me paralysed and unable to speak to I can't 'call out his name'. Praying franticly hasn't helped or I think it doesn't because nothing happens for a good while, and don't even get me started on the dreams where they introduced themselves to me and synchronised the pain to make me believe that it was real.

    For 7 years I truly believed that this was the truth, nothing else would have made a seventeen-year-old give up his education and his life, and this is was what I got. To say that I'm angry is an understatement, however I am no longer bitter about the whole situation, just mega confused. Interestingly enough, after recently finding out about the true date of Jerusalem's destruction, it not being 607BCE, and its implication for the Watchtower society, I have been in contact with the JWs again, to discuss what I have found. They can't see the big picture and even if they could, most of them are far to dependent to leave and now start thinking for themselves. I got a copy of their new book, which discusses Daniel, it’s the only publication from the JWs in my bedroom, and low and behold, another attack and smiling face that fades away. It would bitter irony if all this time that the one thing that I thought would protect me from the demons is the one thing that has given them a free pass to rain on my parade. My obvious question would be, why the HELL is this happening to ME??? I'm far too insignificant to warrant all this attention from the demons. At the height of my 'spirituality' the attacks were every night. The more hours I put in, the more I was punished. When I hit a low and wanted to get back with more studying, the more I was punished. Even when I thought that this was Satan's way of trying to put me off the truth, is still didn't make sense to me. When I finally told an elder one who had been a CO and a DO, even he said that in the 40 or so years that he had been in the truth he had never heard of this, especially in a 1st world country.

    As it stands, I still have a belief in god, but with this still going on, what I'm to think? Is this to be my penance for 7 years of trying to serve god the best way I could? I have become disillusioned with the whole concept of god and religion. The sheer ambiguity of if all is just too much for me to bear, thinking that god has answered your prayer only for it to blow up in your face, its just happened with too much constancy to be coincidence. I haven't spoken to god in sooo long I can't remember, and yet in the 21/2 years since I left, I have lived my life as if god doesn't care about me, but my quality of life has increase a thousand fold. Mentally, I have so much clarity that you would think that god and myself are inseparable. I do feel closer to him now that I'm not affiliated with a religion and don't expect ANTHING from him. Would this be the definition of a paradox??

    Tell me…. what do you think.

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