Individual Thought

jaccilynn

a few nights ago i asked two of my friends to watch the "young people ask: how can i make real friends?" video with me, so that i could get an objective outside opinion.

and after watching it, we got into an hour long discussion about individual thought, the freedom of the mind, and the diffrences between personal opinions and forced opinions. also how organized religion is a completely un-natural thing to strap yourself to, because of individualisim.

everyone is completely diffrent then everyone else. that is apparent just from looking at someone's physical appearance. of course, everyone's mind is COMPLETELY diffrent also, that's the freedom that we were given when we were created. how ridiculous would it be then, to believe that millions of people could have the EXACT same views on god, the bible, jesus, anything for that matter?? it's impossible. it's like millions of diverse people trying to look exactly the same. sure, there is plastic surgery, but even that is fake. isn't the same true with people conforming their minds to fit in to an organized religion? not just the WTBTS, but all religions that do not promote free thinking? it's just not resonable to think that god would give everyone free will, and not want them to use it! ugh!

just ranting... any thoughts welcome.

Billygoat

Hi Jaccilynn,

First of all welcome to the board! I hope you find some healing and hope here.

I've been out since 1990, so I don't know anything about the Young People Ask video. You just seem light years ahead of where I was at your age. (I don't know your age, but I'm assuming you're pretty young if you're watching that video. Am I correct?) Free thinking was not something I was brought up around, but looking back, my soul was trying so hard to express itself. I was a rebellious one.

You've touched on a point that I never ever thought about. At least not in the way that you mention it:

how ridiculous would it be then, to believe that millions of people could have the EXACT same views on god, the bible, jesus, anything for that matter?? it's impossible.

Interesting. I think I have to chew on that awhile, but it's very interesting. Keep coming back here and asking stuff like that. It's a great way to educate yourself.

Andi

teenyuck

Jaccilynn, that was a good idea to get some objective views.

I agree with you...my thoughts are that since religion is based upon faith and nothing in it can be proven, we are expected to blindly follow. This, IMO, stifles free thought.

People will always have differing ideas. This is seen as wrong and bad in the dub organization. That is what drives me crazy...you cannot carry on a meaningful conversation. They recite answers that have been drilled into their heads. In other orgs, you can at least question something you are taught without fear of retaliation in the form of DF'ing.

jaccilynn

andi: thank you for your welcome. by the way, i am 20 years old.

puffs: that's something else that we touched on in our conversation as well, the fact that most of the beliefs that are carried around by people are drilled into them during youth. alot of people hold on to these beliefs as a form of tradition that's passed on from generation to generation. it's not even a form of faith, it's a form of passing on tradition.

at one point in the video, they were interviewing young people about having a relationship with god, and one young man was saying how jehovah used to be a one word answer that he would give at meetings, but now jehovah is so much more to him, a friend. and i couldn't help thinking that he (and most others raised in the "truth") have no choice because of their upbringing and the constant pushing towards this way of life. it's not a choice, because in order to choose, you have to have more then one option!

it just made me so sad watching the video. knowing that everyone i was watching isn't using the gift of free thinking that was given to them BY GOD. they refuse to think outside of the box, and that breaks my heart.

Billygoat

i couldn't help thinking that he (and most others raised in the "truth") have no choice because of their upbringing and the constant pushing towards this way of life. it's not a choice, because in order to choose, you have to have more then one option!

Oh how I would have loved to tell this to my father when he said, "It's not my fault we aren't close anymore. It was your choice that you left Jehovah, not ours." (I always hear of the perfect come back years later! Haha!)

But his comment also reconfirmed to me that they don't know the difference between Jehovah and the Society. The line has become so blurred they can't see where one ends and the other begins. IMO they aren't even attached!

Jaccilynn, if you keep thinking like that, your exodus will be much easier than many of ours. I don't know you well, but you're on your way through a good journey.

Andi

FRUSR8TD

jaccilynn

you are very correct...I have seen the same "syndrome" in my wife.

TheStar

Frustrated,

My husband has the same syndrome (refusing to think outside the box). It's very frustrating.

airwlk149

stupid video.
my mom made me watch it all the time.
she said it was a wholesome 'dawson's creek'
what a load of shit.
katie

Introspection

A YPA video? Sounds like an after-school special..

I couldn't help but notice how you ended the original message: any thoughts welcome. We do get a lot of external input, not unlike number 5 in Short Circuit. But seriously, my point is that being open is nice, but technically I don't know how individual it really is.

Of course, it seems to me that you should be consistent either way. Either let all the thoughts go, or let them all stay, or atleast have a nice balance. But the thing is whether a thought stays or not isn't really the point, it's all about what it is right? And you do have to make your own decision as to whether it is true or not, and of course that's what we're talking about.

The whole problem as I see it is that people become identified with their thoughts, things like "I'm a Jehovah's Witness" or even I'm an ex-Jehovah's Witness, or whatever. Instead of being yourself or actually changing, you end up developing this identity and protecting it. Of course, if the identity is challenged and ultimately shown to have no substantial reality behind it, then you feel like you have been broken. In reality it is just that your identity is seen for what it is, it's just this story you tell yourself. See, to me thought often creates this false self image in the first place, and that is really redundant because any image is only an image and not the real thing. So then the question is, who am I really? You've always been there, and sure having spent years as a witness, that can be seen as a part of you. But who are you? There are stories that you tell yourself (or others tell you) and roles that you play, but I think by far the most useful thing is this simple question. I think if most people - JW, Ex, or neither, honestly ask themselves this question, the answer would be that they don't know.

Edited so I don't sound stupid

FRUSR8TD

STAR!

The first so far to pickup on the "truth" behind my screen name. LOL

Individual Thought

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