If Adam had not sinned, would he be in heaven now?

stevieb1

One of the ways the WT tries to get you into believing you are not going to heaven even if you d not have faith in Christ is by saying that if Adam had not sinned we would all be living in a paradise earth. The publication "Reasoning from the Scriptures" states on page 162: "It wa not Jehovah's original purpose for man someday to die.......Death was to be punishment for disobedience, not the doorway to a better life in heaven. Obedience would have ben rewarded by continued life, eternal life, in the Paradise that God had given to man. See also Isaiah 45:18"

Does anyone have any comment on this matter?

sunstarr

I've thought about this before. I guess I question their reasoning. True, God directed Adam and Eve to "fill the earth." Does that mean that His plans ended there? How does the Society know what His purpose for mankind was after that? For all we know, He planned for the earth to be filled and then to raise some or all to heaven. Or perhaps He planned to populate other planets. To say that we were not intended for heaven is just speculation based on their original directive. Just my thoughts.

Defender

That is a good question, but in order to get a proper perspective, ask the inverse questions below and you will see why.

If Adam had not sinned, would Jesus still come in the flesh, die, be raised from the dead and rule as King for a thousand years?

If Adam had not sinned, would there be 144,000 (per WT understanding)going to heaven?

If Adam had not sinned, would angels come down from heaven and have intercourse with women on earth?

If Adam had not sinned, would the flood of Noah be necessary?

If Adam had not sinned, would God still give people many languages and disperse them from building their tower in Babylon.

If Adam had not sinned, would there be a necessity to setup the commandments, law, temple, priests, sacrifices, etc..?

If Adam had not sinned, would Satan need to be abyssed and later destroyed with his followers?

If Adam had not sinned, would Armageddon be necessary?

If Adam had not sinned, would there be a need for the Resurrection?

and on and on...

Obviously then, when Adam sinned, a whole lot of things changed, including the heavenly calling of the true followers of Christ.

larc

Look on the bright side.

If Adam hadn't sinned, the world would have filled up with people long before our time, and we won't ever have been alive.

It seems to me that God makes up the rules as he goes along. He didn't get the heaven idea until Jesus came on the scene.

aChristian

Any question beginning with the words, "If Adam had not sinned," is moot. Why? Because Adam was not given a test. He participated in a demonstration. The only way the story of Adam and Eve makes sense is to understand that God not only knew how things were going to end up in Eden, but that He deliberately set the whole thing up to make a point. What point? This one. If Adam in paradise, without a problem in the world, could not manage to obey one simple command from God, what chance does any human being have of living their entire trouble-plagued life without sinning either in word, thought or deed? No chance at all. That is the lesson that was illustrated in Eden. Human beings are all incapable of living perfectly righteous lives. And because we are, we are all unworthy of eternal life.

That's the bad news. Now the Good News. Even though God's own high standards (Only those who are perfectly righteous deserve to live forever.) demanded our deaths as the penalty for our sins, He is willing to accept the death of Jesus Christ in place of the deaths of all who now also accept Christ's death as payment in full for all their sins. And because God accepts Christ's death as payment for the sins of Christians, He no longer considers Christians to be sinners. Rather, He considers them to be righteous ones who are now fully worthy of eternal life. And because He does, He now promises to give eternal life to all who put their faith in Jesus Christ.

gumby

God had already planned Jesus coming in the flesh,taking man to heaven
before he made man. Sounds silly eh? It is still free will we have but God knows the choice before we make it.
Before the 'founding of the world'..the bible says he planned the above mentioned things.

Why did he start something that would end up like this?
Is there a bigger picture we don't see? Perhaps,...just maybe?

Adonai438

Gumby, ya read my mind!
No, technically, Adam would not be in heaven because he wouldn't have died yet. The wages of sin is DEATH. No sin = No death.
We may think it's dumb for God to create us with a free will that he knows we'll screw up and he'll have to come and save us from but there is a bigger picture. Creating us without free will would have made us basiclly robots and no true love, emotion or joy could come from that. To have all those things God allowed us to choose and made a way for us to choose him.

Yadirf

Carl aka Larc,

If Adam hadn't sinned, the world would have filled up with people long before our time, and we won't ever have been alive.

That's not at all true, Carl. The material universe is literally packed with places (other worlds/planets) for man to multiply and spread out to. Even if we were to suppose that such places weren't yet habitable in say Adam's day, how long would it take for God to make them habitable. Like I've asked before, Carl: Are you sure that you're a retired teacher?

Daniel 11:35 ... a KEY prophecy that must be fulfilled before the "time of the end" gets underway.

pseudoxristos

If Adam had not sinned, would he get bored of perfection after a few billion years, and finally sin just to spice things up?

If Adam had not sinned, would there be any place to stand on earth after a few billion years of pro-creation?

Did Adam really have a choice?

gravedancer

A good question. One which raises multitudes of isses and logical questions. Let's consider just one of them.

Someone alluded to this issue that they cannot explain:

Lets's assume the logic is true that everyone, including grandaddy Adam would be alive on earth - if Adam had not sinned.

For the sake of the let's acknowledge that Adam did sin and God sent Jesus to redeem mankind so that we could once again have the opportunity to live on earth forever.

OK....the issue comes to the 144,000. If Adam had NOT sinned....there would be no 144,000? Or would there.

Perhaps your answer is NO. OK - then why do we need them NOW then? Was God's purpose for the earth not good enough for them? Or were they some type of reward for Jesus? You cannot use the old reasoning: "since they came from earth they understand us better..." beacuse I will throw it back at you and say: "Ah, so if Adam had not sinned we would have been ruled without the understanding that earthlings could offer the heavenly rullers?"

WAIT!!!!! I know what the religionist/believers answer is: The Bible does not say and we are speculating on the thoughts and intentions and purposes of God.

Fine - I say. I accept and applaud your answer. But next time you ask me to have FAITH in something or in some issue which you cannot explain logically can I use your answer - word for word?

...intellectual honesty is so elusive - isn't it?

If Adam had not sinned, would he be in heaven now?

Share this