The October 1 Watchtower 2001 features articles on training children "properly" and dealing with a "prodigal child."

The latest inside U.S. figures reveal that 86% of JW children leave the fold, with some 29% who eventually come back for reasons of family ties, most never "reaching out." That means over HALF leave permanently. These figures have been virtually the same for a number of years now. Well known is the fact that many kids lead a double life; that is, they put on a Witness face while attempting to live more normally away from scrutiny.

In its usual truthful fashion, the Watchtower says: "There are hundreds of thousands of young ones who serve Jehovah happily ... Why, then, do other young ones leave?" Uh, that's over eight out of ten, remember?

Answers: 'Losing out on what the world offers, protective sheepfold too restrictive, peer pressure, hypocrisy on part of the parents or some other Christian.'

It's about "spiritual weakness," we are told. "Not having an accurate knowledge." "A youth who admitted that he had been swallowed up in the way of the world began to appreciate spiritual values. What helped him turn around? Responding to a suggestion to read the whole Bible, he kept to a regular Bible reading schedule." (Why don't I buy this?)

They trot out the tried and true recommendations: "Being reasonable includes preparing the children's heart so that they are ready to accept counsel." Family study, daily Scriptural discussion.

Why not try your family study on meeting nights? Now that's a practical suggestion! "The family was always together on the nights of the congregation meetings ... all three children are now baptized servants of Jehovah." Ah, yes, they cite the perfect family study in which a grown son says: "It was one of the most enjoyable evenings in the week."

Ooops! Here's what NOT to do: "In one congregation, well-meaning adults who wanted to help some youths who had become spiritually weak invited them to gatherings to play popular music together. Though the youths readily complied [sic!] and enjoyed such sessions, their influence on one another eventually led them to cut their ties with the congregation."

Aaaannnnkkk! No more "gatherings."

I won't go through all the Talmudic stuff on when a child is DFd; no prayer publicly in his behalf, blah, blah. But here's a gem: "Parents MIGHT pray that if God FINDS A BASIS for pardoning the child's error, that His will be done. Hearing these prayers should help the youth to see Jehovah as a merciful God." (I have a picture in my head of God sitting on his throne, desperately trying to come up with some legal basis for pardoning a wayward kid.)

Words, words, words. Their tenor is fine, but I can stomach no more. This is the same tired, tedious approach I personally have seen over and over and over again, for over half a century. Isn't there a definition of insanity as doing the same thing over and over again, expecting different results?

If only a few were leaving, why publish this article?

What's your experience with kids who lead double lives and who finally leave the organization?

Maximus

They never accept any blame for their corrupt organization,
do they?

I'm glad to see these scandalous figures provided. They could
never tell Witness parents the REAL truth - "the cards
are stacked against you, you may as well give up!"

I got together with another family and we talked for hours
about how almost none of their extended family's kids
are still "in the truth". Rotten elders, uncaring brothers,
endless rules, and a hope never realized - how much longer
can the suffering go on?

metatron

Maximus, well written and well thought out, as always.

In the 1980's, a CO visiting our congregation gave the figure that one out of eight kids leaves the Witnesses. He didn't say where he got them, but that figures out to about 88% leave - VERY nearly your figure.

What we found that was interesting, was that my wife and I were talking about that afterward, and remembered the congregations we grew up in in the 1960's. And damned if it didn't come out to exactly one out of eight kids that we grew up with stayed with the Org.

So I would say that your experience of half a century is similar to my somewhat shorter one - the vast majority of kids leave the Witnesses. I'm reminded what an elder in a local, reclusive cult in my home area told me. I asked him about how many of the young people raised in the group stay with it. He told me that his group would consider it the worst kind of failure if many of the children left. His point was that if the children raised in the group struggled to see it as having a superior way of life and being the truth, what chance was there that outsiders could be convinced?

It was a point well taken.

There is an insanity to the WTS, as you said. Doing the same things over and over, and expecting different results. More study, prayer, meeting attendance and family study didn't make a difference in the 60's, the 80's or the 90's. And they certainly won't in this new century. The WTS is doomed.

Always great to read your stuff.
S4

G'day Max,

Nice post.

When reading the suggestion to have a family study on meeting night I'm reminded of how much from the platform was received with raised eyebrows from the struggling parents. Their reaction? "What would they know? They haven't got any kids." I'm sure that reaction is found all round the world. Upon the announcemnet of a new circuit overseer to the circuit what is the common thought? "He's an older man with grownup children, so he must have some experience."

The pictures in the magazines showing the ideal family (in Oz we refer to them as the all-American family - no offense meant!) actually have a negative effect because most families view that as unattainable, they'll never be like that, so they'll never be "good enough".

Down in Sydney it became known that there was an 'underclass' of young JWs made up of 'fringe' JWs and some who are regular meeting attenders and 'token' publishers. They have their own network to arrange social activities. Certainly they are leading double lives. Elders seldom hear of their activities because their own children are excluded from invitations. I venture to estimate that this underclass is numerically stronger than the 'official' JW young ones.

Your comment about "spiritual weakness" and "not having an accurate knowledge" is most apropos. I made these comments on MrMoe's thread "You Can Have True Faith - October 1, 2001 W/T" Of course the organisation continues to use the enforced compliance methods that use rules as their medium. This is so much like the Pharisees of Jesus' day. The org has not come to appreciate that love is the thing that is needed along with faith. The works will naturally follow. The R&F may protest that "we need rules" but they miss the whole point of the Christian message.

Cheers,
Ozzie

"Evil is the absence of empathy"
Movie (2000), Nuremberg

Marvin,

Why do I get the feeling that there will be many reports going back in that thank the "faithful slave" profusely for this fine fact-finding mission? Damned if I didn't get letters from the Society asking my "frank observations" DECADES ago. They paid no attention whatsoever.

What is the primary, most important teaching of the organization today? Hint: it has nothing to do with preaching or the established Kingdom.

Although it made up of infallible, imperfect men,
THE GOVERNING BODY IS INFALLIBLE AND MUST BE OBEYED
under penalty of enforced shunning.

Not for one moment do I think the GB is going to pay attention to the most earnest and sincere kid who says there are too many meetings! These kids have a bad attitude; go back and read the W 10/1/2001 for suggestions.

Uh, Seeker, was that one out of eight REMAINS you meant to say?

Felix! Sent you a private note re sources of figures.

Maximus

"I won't go through all the Talmudic stuff on when a child is DFd;..."

Maximus, please do. I'd like to "see" what it says verbatim. Such fond memories all those years ago...I'd like to reminiese a bit. I forget just what the exact words were. Please share them, again.

Sincerely, sKally (dfed 24years now klass)

Max,

Oops! Of course. One out of eight STAYS was what I meant. Sorry.

S4

G'day hillary_step,

Interesting points you raise.
"Smarting back-sides in Paris last week" - guess the Brooklyn/Patterson boys will be getting Frequent Flyer points as they've got a lot of declining branches to visit!

Australia is no different. Max Lloyd's committee here will have to be 'explaining' too, I guess.

Cheers,
Ozzie

"Evil is the absence of empathy"
Movie (2000), Nuremberg

Thanks for the interesting thread guys. I would have to agree that the numbers presented seem pretty accurate with what i've seen where I live.

I was wondering though, how exactly the Society can determine these percentages considering many young persons are not disfellowshipped but just cease involvement. The numbers seem accurate, but how are they arrived at?

I have been perplexed lately at the amount of young ones who leave, but then make the "comeback". I would say very few of those who leave do so because they disagree with the doctrines. Many return and most want to return or feel that the should return at a future date.

As for those who remain in the religion, most lead double-lives. Those with any interest in "spiritual goals" appears to be at an all time low with more young ones pursuing some sort of additional education.

If the Society had any brains, they would be reshaping the religion to appeal to these young ones instead of driving them away with comments about family studies on meeting nights. How exactly does a family do that? When do these kids do their homework?

Path

I think that kids being kids, they want to explore life. When you grow up with too many rules, you can tend to be more rebellious. And it just makes some young people all the more curious. Kids, as well as adults need balance in their lives. As it is, the JW kids aren't allowed to do much of anything. Everything is wrong. Music is all wrong, Dress is all wrong, cong. gatherings so strictly scrutinized, it takes all joy out of it for everyone. Yes, we do need guidelines and rules within reason. Please, by all means, use common sense when picking associates. This is all good advice. But, it seems JW kids arent't allowed to be spontaneous. Everything is TOO regulated.