The Problem of Evil, "Free Will" and Questions of Morality

by gubberningbody 16 Replies latest watchtower bible

  • gubberningbody
    gubberningbody

    JW's say that God has only the limitations he himself has placed upon himself and that he keeps faith with himself.

    They further say that all evil is the result of the challenge to his sovereignty. The time man's experienced evil is to the end of proving the rightfulness and righteousness of Jehovah, his way of ruling and that he didn't create defective creatures with free will, but rather the defect was their own - they chose evil. Other things subsidiary, to these but contingent on them too.

    The Daily Text of Wednesday, January 14, 2008 says...

    Jehovah is a lover of justice.—Ps. 37:28.

    Because of his love of justice, Jehovah refrained from wiping out the rebels in Eden. Why? Satan’s rebellion raised a question regarding the rightness of God’s sovereignty. Jehovah’s sense of justice required that Satan’s challenge be given a just answer. The immediate execution of the rebels, while well-deserved, would not have provided such an answer. It would have provided further evidence of Jehovah’s supremacy in power, but his power was not in question . Furthermore, Jehovah had stated his purpose to Adam and Eve. They were to have offspring and were to fill the earth, subdue it, and have all earthly creation in subjection. (Gen. 1:28) If Jehovah had simply destroyed Adam and Eve, his stated purpose regarding humans would have become empty words. Jehovah’s justice would never allow for such an outcome, for his purpose is always accomplished.—Isa. 55:10, 11. w07 5/15 1:13, 14

    Now the question I have is as follows:

    Could Jehovah have created all the angels and man with faux free will such that these imagined that they actually had free will, but in point of fact did not?

    This leading to the end that Satan would never have tried to tempt Eve ( though the thought would have been allowed to come to mind) his internal programming as it were causing him to revolt from the idea after having considered it.

    So too, suppose Eve and Adam both had been presented with the command to not eat from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil and in fact imagined they had the ability to choose to do so, but in point of fact did not.

    Suppose the same were so of all intelligent creation.

    Suppose we had been created with this sort of faux free will...

    Would we not all be enjoying life congratulating ourselves on our loyalty and integrity as one big happy family instead of what we have today?

    If Jehovah could have done that, why didn't he?

    The answer I got from a number was "Jehovah would know the truth."

    My response was... "So this is all about him huh?!"

    Where is the morality of a loving God in this equation?

  • oompa
    oompa

    and is suppose this "challenge of gods sovereignty" and this important issue is discussed throughout the Bible?......was it really a big deal if god let satan stay in heaven for thousands of years to infect other angels???.......even after killing his own son sent to earth?!?!??!.........he STILL is not kicked out of heaven for nearly 2000 years?!?!?!?...........oh ya.......it was a very important issue...........oompa

  • oompa
    oompa

    WTF is the "rightness of gods sovereignty"?!?!??!?........."his power was not in question"????...............well duh........usually the way it works is.......the ones with the most power RULE!!!!!..........where the hell is there anything to question?..........and what would make it "right" for him to rule????...........just about to barf/explode........oompa

  • truthseeker
    truthseeker

    When an evil doers FREE WILL affects a good person's FREE WILL what then?

  • gubberningbody
    gubberningbody

    Shameless bump.

  • drwtsn32
    drwtsn32

    God is omnibenevolent. You, puny human, are not allowed to question his motives or actions.

    You have been warned.

  • gubberningbody
    gubberningbody

    Now suppose we don't have free will but in point of fact have faux free will and that this was true of Adam and Eve and Satan as well.

    Wouldn't that make Jehovah to blame?

    How could a person ever know that they had "free will"?

    Just because I can't establish an intermediate element in a chain of events I observe in connection with myself and my imagined volition doesn't remove all doubt that there is an intermediate and more real element in my self observed sequence.

  • WTWizard
    WTWizard

    It is all a scam. The religions have to come up with some crap to justify why God allows evil. The real truth is that God is evil--He made stupid rules that were intended to prevent us from using our brains to improve our own lives, and then came up with the idea of creating the Original Sin scam. Of course, that would require a "savior", and an arrangement to show how much He "loves" us in that He is willing to provide the way out of this. The reality is that He hates us so much that He is willing to create a problem that no more than enslaves people.

  • Caedes
    Caedes

    Surely the problem with this whole cosmic bet between god and satan is that satan said man could rule himself and god sad we couldn't. The 'history' in the bible is inconsistant with that wager since god is constantly meddling throughout the whole old testament. The tower of Babylon, the flood, sodom and gomorrah, the Isrealite's genocidal wars, god is constantly poking his cosmic finger in the pot and giving things a stir. I would say the wager is null and void due to cheating!

  • Spook
    Spook

    Sovereignty is the worst response to theodicy. The JW theology can rightly be said to be false because Jehovah, were he to exist, cannot possibly have the set of characteristics attributed to him. Other theists can better get around this.

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