Posts by TonusOH

39

What Does Prayer Actually Do?

by punkofnice in

if you think it works, what is your evidence outside of possible coincidence?.

TonusOH

Anony Mous: Proper prayer is basically a form of meditation.

That's how I see it. I don't know how beneficial 'self-talk' is, but I find it useful at times in helping me focus on goals and/or get my thoughts in order. I think it served the same purpose when I believed in god, I just assumed that it worked in a different way.

I find that many people interpret prayer the same way they interpret scripture. Focus on the things that reinforce it, and redefine anything that might cast doubt. In other words- if you prayed for something and got it, it's proof that prayer works. If you prayed and nothing seems to be happening, it's proof that prayer works, because god is just telling you that you need to be patient. If you pray for something and get something different, it's proof that prayer works, because god knew what you needed and provided it. Even tragedies can be explained away as evidence that god listened to the prayer. No explanation seems too strange or outrageous, as long as you can maintain the belief that god is answering you.

32

Date of Adam's "Creation?

by Slidin Fast in

how do jws resolve these conflicting facts.. 1. no matter how you spin it, bible chronology calculates to circa 4000 bc for adam's creation.

i followed the trail many years ago and that's what it adds up to.. 2. the most cursory investigation of any branch of relevant science puts man's habitation on the earth as hugely earlier than that.

it's now so well-proved that anyone disputing it is guilty of wilful ignorance.

TonusOH

The only way they can get away from it is to claim the OT is just a story, and not real.

I wonder if the GB ever discuss that. They've gone with the "Biblical literalist" label for so long, that it would be a huge risk. But it would also open up an almost endless number of new interpretations that could allow them to reshape the organization from the bottom up, as long as they did it slowly and carefully enough.

Why, by 2040 or so, they might even vouch for evolution!

11530

It's been a long 9 years Lloyd Evans / John Cedars

by Newly Enlightened in

original reddit post (removed).

TonusOH

If you don't like him but you keep posting on why he is around instead of just moving on with your life

I would expect that people who do not like him would be more likely to comment on the issue. He's treated a lot of people quite poorly over the years and has been a remorseless self-promoter. In other words, the kind of person that people are going to enjoy watching flame out. I have not had any direct dealings with him, so my own involvement is just watching it with some interest. As I said before, if he wasn't so good at making his downfall so compelling, many of us would've grown bored and found something else to follow.

As for the second part, my life is not affected by this topic one way or another. I think you're overestimating the time anyone gives to Evans and the recent turbulence in his life. Aside from the occasional video, it doesn't take long to catch up on the issue and make a comment or two. I don't mind a person having a difference of opinion on the guy, but I'm not moved by requests on how I can better spend my time. I'm a grown-up, I've managed for myself quite well. I'm sure I can handle a single web topic. But... thanks, I guess?

11530

It's been a long 9 years Lloyd Evans / John Cedars

by Newly Enlightened in

original reddit post (removed).

TonusOH

What makes it entertaining for me is that he built up his brand, at least in part, by being an obnoxious jerk to others. Even that might have worn off by now, but his determination to dig in and keep pushing a script where he is the downtrodden hero and everyone else is the malicious villain keeps things fresh and interesting. I'll give him credit, he's always been very, very good at bringing attention to himself.

Of course, now he's unhappy with the attention is getting, but that's just how it goes. Be a shitty person, win shitty prizes. Or something like that. Can't wait for his next foot-in-mouth moment!

32

Date of Adam's "Creation?

by Slidin Fast in

how do jws resolve these conflicting facts.. 1. no matter how you spin it, bible chronology calculates to circa 4000 bc for adam's creation.

i followed the trail many years ago and that's what it adds up to.. 2. the most cursory investigation of any branch of relevant science puts man's habitation on the earth as hugely earlier than that.

it's now so well-proved that anyone disputing it is guilty of wilful ignorance.

TonusOH

Most civilizations were established and grew around sources of fresh water, which means that there would have been villages and cities on or near rivers and lakes. It's not unusual for rivers to have seasonal flooding, with the occasional large-scale flood that can destroy crops and buildings and take enough lives that they become part of the local lore.

One "evidence" that is used for the validity of the global flood is that there are many flood stories around the world that purport to there having been a worldwide flood. But the fact that flooding would have been a common human experience, and the way our myths and legends develop, make it inevitable that stories about "great floods" would be so widespread across so many different cultures.

11530

It's been a long 9 years Lloyd Evans / John Cedars

by Newly Enlightened in

original reddit post (removed).

TonusOH

They do allow divorce for infidelity, though they will encourage even those couples to stay together, lest they bring disrepute to the good name of Jehovah (lol?).

11530

It's been a long 9 years Lloyd Evans / John Cedars

by Newly Enlightened in

original reddit post (removed).

TonusOH

Just to add: he appears to be a former Bible Student (one of the offshoots of the Millerite movement, like the JWs). He makes two particularly salient points:

1. He notes how harsh Evans was in dealing with the Tony Morris booze-buying video, and wonders how he would have reacted if he learned that Morris had, instead, visited a prostitute.

2. He notes that, among the things Evans has not done, is promise that "it [cheating on his wife with prostitutes] won't happen again." He admits that he cannot continue to support Evans financially if he thinks it is possible that Evans will continue to seek out prostitutes and cheat on his wife.

I wonder how many other patrons feel the same way.

11530

It's been a long 9 years Lloyd Evans / John Cedars

by Newly Enlightened in

original reddit post (removed).

TonusOH

Here's someone whose obsession with the issue is probably very relevant to Evans. It's a former patron who admits to being a very generous supporter (and possibly the most generous of his supporters), but who felt that... well, let's let him explain it:

"I believe that a person who is doing that kind of advocacy work on behalf of a community should live to higher standards and be held to certain standards. Especially when they're critical of hypocrisy of the agency they're criticizing."

This guy doesn't appear to be an exJW, and is an atheist. Nor does he seem to be aware (or bothered by) the way Evans has treated many in the exJW community. In other words, the kind of person that some would expect was not upset by Lloyd's actions. It does seem as if he is aware of the videos from other exJWs, and that those may have had an impact on his decision. Yet his decision is driven by the things Lloyd admitted to, not the stuff he claims are being made up about him.

He makes a very clear case about how Evans's actions affect the way he is viewed now.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7b6IvHVWBfg

11530

It's been a long 9 years Lloyd Evans / John Cedars

by Newly Enlightened in

original reddit post (removed).

TonusOH

The statement is a non-sequitur anyway. If he promised to use the funds only for his activism, at the very least he has to answer to his patrons for it, or they may decide (as they have, by the hundreds) that they do not wish to support him with their money anymore. Whether or not he is a professional activist does not have anything to do with it.

If he wanted to explain himself to his patrons, taking the arrogant "I can do as I please" attitude was probably not the best approach. Because, as he is learning, they can do as they please with their money as well.

11530

It's been a long 9 years Lloyd Evans / John Cedars

by Newly Enlightened in

original reddit post (removed).

TonusOH

As with anything if you don't like what he does don't watch.

Good advice. For the record, I no longer watch his videos. But I'm morbidly interested in watching as he flames out in public, a downfall that could have occurred behind closed doors if he hadn't decided to stand in front of a camera and tell us all the lurid details. Even that probably wouldn't have lasted long, but he's a big fish in a small pond and he spent quite a number of years splashing about and making the pond rather unpleasant for others. So there's the added benefit of getting a healthy dose of schadenfreude as we watch him continue to very publicly humiliate himself.