Posts by Spiral

20

Watchtower says: if your unbelieving relatives think you are in a cult, try to see things from their point of view

by cognisonance in

12 have empathy for unbelieving relatives.

while we may be overjoyed about the bible truths we have learned, our relatives may mistakenly believe that we have been tricked or have become part of a cult.

we should show empathy by trying to see things from their viewpoint and by listening carefully to discern their real concerns.

There's nothing quite like a member of a cult being told by their leaders to behave like they are not in a cult. Nice, smiling faces, "tolerant" and patronising view of those who believe it is really a cult, etc. And never open-minded enough to realise those who believe it is a cult could be correct.

Despite the Watchtower's archly unrealistic admonition (acting school anyone?), i have yet to meet a JW anywhere who could carry out this type of lame-minded charade.

Oh boy....... this is really something. I don't recall this issue - to cult, or not to cult- being written about so openly, but then I haven't been reading anything WT for the last decade. But, in its screwball way, it does show that the GB are aware that people think the JWs are a cult (duh.....) and in their hamfisted way they need to deal with it. Kinda like Nixon (and soon Trump) saying "I am not a crook! I am not a crook!"

45

Clapping and singing in Conventions... like the evangelicals??

by ILoveTTATT2 in

jw
friends

https://www.facebook.com/traslapados/videos/1470101566382318/?hc_ref=otherwhat do you think of this video?.

do you think they're imitating evangelicals?is this happening in other places?

?.

Spiral

Pete Zahut

I think it's a nice change myself and it would have been nice if things were this way for those of us who grew up as JW's. The only thing that bothers me is that they used to say this kind of thing was inappropriate and they could show you scriptures to show the importance of being "serious minded" and "reverent" in our worship to Jehovah.

It also bothers me that they make these changes but never apologize for having spoiled our fun and for condemning other religions for doing this very thing. They never even mention the fact that these things were frowned upon in the past.

LIke so much of my life as a JW in the past, it's as if it never happened....never even mattered.

I could not agree more! Outpourings of "spirit" were looked down upon by the JWs in the 60s and 70s, I remember many people thought the Pentecostals were demonized. ANYTHING you could think of to brighten up the meeting was forbidden.

I remember when it was decided all weddings could only have (canned) kingdom songs played, ugh, it was just so sad. Also any kind of larger party (say, a costume or themed party) also became forbidden. A large group was over 10 people (in some elders' minds). Things just got so depressing.

BUT - the JWs were so smug and superior, being so much better than those other churches. And having anything on TV was also straight from Satan, JWs were above that.

And now, it's as if it never happened.

@PeteZaHut, but why do you think the JWs in the 40 plus age group don't see the irony of it all? (I know why, but still!)

15

Lack of open-mindedness

by ilikecheese in

jw
friends

a lot of religious folks can have an open-minded discussion about their beliefs without getting defensive.

some can actually consider things from another point of view and point out the validity in the other person's point.

obviously, a lot of jws may just be scared to think/speak in a semi-detrimental way about their religion.

Spiral

Lack of education of all sorts.

A lot of religious people are educated, and have an open mind. Just as some politically minded people are open minded, but some are not. But anyone who does not endeavor to have a well-rounded, informed view is going to be closed minded.

In the case of the JWs, because the Org makes it a point of pride to be stubborn and closed minded, the sheep follow their leaders.

14

Who are the trolly dolly jobos?

by punkofnice in

so, i've been away from any meetings of the jobos for around 5 years.

i'm glad i'm out but the fallout and loss damn near destroyed me.

but, being a stiff upper lip brit, i 'kbo.

Spiral

@OrphanCrow Interesting. We know they will change the rules or get new light as necessary. I also think that keeping the publishers mindlessly busy is a plus. Saw a cart today when I was out, and by where it was placed and the behavior of the two sisters in attendance, it was the ultimate mindless activity. They were at a drugstore entrance, but situated in such a way (i.e. on the wrong side of the walkway) that no one was stopping. Although that might have been at the request of management, it certainly didn't look productive. They also were making absolutely no effort to make eye contact with anyone.

16

Beards a-poppin!

by neat blue dog in

i live in a pretty conservative area of the united states, and in the past two decades i can remember 2, that's right, two instances of seeing a jw with a beard in my area.

(not counting myself at times, 😜, and i'm obviously not counting bearded visitors dressed in casual clothes).. however at this year's convention, i saw about a dozen bearded jws .

this is like an explosion where i live.

Spiral

Or maybe, just maybe, there's such a shortage of younger brothers who are "reaching out" (blech) that they are willing to budge just a little.

steve2: Necessity is the mother of new light. Policies change because circumstances force the change.

Yep!

smiddy: Your overview reminds me that pretty much everything "important" we learned growing up is gone!

16

Beards a-poppin!

by neat blue dog in

i live in a pretty conservative area of the united states, and in the past two decades i can remember 2, that's right, two instances of seeing a jw with a beard in my area.

(not counting myself at times, 😜, and i'm obviously not counting bearded visitors dressed in casual clothes).. however at this year's convention, i saw about a dozen bearded jws .

this is like an explosion where i live.

Spiral

Or maybe, just maybe, there's such a shortage of younger brothers who are "reaching out" (blech) that they are willing to budge just a little. (I have heard that there has been a real shortage of worker bee MS-wannabes volunteering to the the grunt work. That makes it hard of the special ones to do what they need to do.)

So, giving in a little on beards might help. Later, of course, they might change their minds and pull the carpet right out from under the bearded ones. There might not be anyone left to care.

3

Need help finding a Watchtower quote

by Zoos in

mid to late 70's, watchtower made a comment regarding the constantly changing doctrines of "false religion" and how discouraging it was to their flocks.

i can't remember enough exact key words to pull it from the archives but i know i have seen it quoted and discussed on this site.. thanks in advance for your help..

Spiral

Wow, Zoos. I don't remember these quotes but these are gold. How appropriate these are, as nothing changes as quickly as beliefs in JW land.

26

Were You Surprised You Remained a JW As Long As You Did?

by minimus in

jw
friends

we have been told there's no place else to go.

and to some degree mentally speaking, that is true especially if you were raised in the religion.

at 50 i was out of the organization's clutches.

Spiral

Actually, as I think about it, I would say yes. If it was easier to leave I think I would have left long before I did (when I was about 50 as well). Hard to quantify, because mentally I was out way before I was physically out.

24

What changes would JW.org need to make to become a normal Christian denomination.

by UnshackleTheChains in

i am interested in getting people's thoughts on this.

on average 40 thousand people leave the organisation yearly for one reason or another.

the experiences all over the media are proof of this.

Spiral

All of the above. Plus (if not mentioned) a total stop to the preaching work. And, instead of the meetings as they are, offer youth activities, senior activities, events, helping at soup kitchens, etc. Stuff that really matters to people. AND - quit talking about the destruction of the world, and stop the bunker videos.

There would be nothing left that any of us would recognize.

15

I remember my Grandfather who was a CO saying;

by dogon in

i was thinking of my co grandfather who passed on a few years ago.

his wife my grandmother passed on in 99. i can remember him saying "i know after armageddon i can not be married to her but maybe we can live next to each other.

not sure where the cult stands on this issue today.

Spiral

I didn't know the teaching had changed on this.

How cruel, really. They are so dogmatic and certain about their teachings....... until they are not. A lot of damage is done to a lot of people, and the faithful don't dare complain.