The nutty part is that conviction or longtime religious beliefs are reduced to membership status. The WT is wrong to not defend a person, any person, who they have reason to believe is a conscientious objector, the government is wrong to make a policy based upon membership.
peacefulpete
JoinedPosts by peacefulpete
-
37
NO SUPPORT FOR EXJWS DRAFTED IN UKRAINE
by raymond frantz inhttps://youtu.be/ulan2hhagz8?si=jpedzunzb5o_6axd.
here’s a cautionary tale for anyone counting on past ties with jehovah’s witnesses to dodge conscription: they’ll throw you under the bus faster than you can say “conscientious objector.” a man in ukraine learned this the hard way after refusing military service and hoping his old religious connections would save him.
spoiler alert—they didn’t.
-
-
-
33
Museum Pic
by peacefulpete ina lot of ink has been spilled on the topic of the cross.
the wt felt it had uncovered some deep conspiracy when they found a number of words were used to describe how jesus was understood to have been killed.
there was an extensive thread many years ago that in short strongly supports the conclusion that at least some nt writers envisioned a cross, while others had a tree in mind.
-
-
peacefulpete
I threw a couple threads back to the top because there is a comment that related to another thread and it took me an hour to find them.
-
26
What if JWs voted in elections?
by Las Malvinas son Argentinas inall this political banter is exhausting, so i want to ask a question that has probably been asked before, so here it goes….
let’s try to keep this non-partisan - just give your opinion and why you think that way.. i’ll go first.
i think jws would generally lean to the right, but not by a whole lot.
-
-
peacefulpete
Funny how many of the Christian Right decry undeserving welfare recipients while praising a God who gave them undeserved grace.
-
152
Do JWs believe Jesus is an angel?
by slimboyfat ini would suggest:.
the short answer is yes.. the longer answer is a qualified yes, with some caveats.
the short answer is yes because jehovah’s witnesses teach that jesus is michael the archangel, their leader, eldest and most powerful, and have taught this since the very beginning of the religion.
-
-
peacefulpete
Moreover, if the early Church had simply invented authorship to lend credibility to these texts, they likely would have chosen more prominent apostles like Peter or James.
Of course, there already were Gospels of Peter and James, and they were very popular.
While this is an interesting interpretation, it lacks solid historical evidence. The idea of a Messiah ben Joseph is not attested in Jewish writings until much later, primarily in rabbinic literature.
(1) Messiah bar Ephraim in the Targums | David C Mitchell - Academia.edu
Jesus reinterpreted this expectation in a radical way, claiming that His own body was the true Temple (John 2:19-21)
The expectation that a Messiah would build the temple is again from Zechariah. 6:
12Then say to him, ‘The LORD of armies says this: “Behold, there is a Man whose name is [f]Branch, for He will [g]branch out from where He is; and He will build the temple of the LORD. 13Yes, it is He who will build the temple of the LORD, and He who will bear the majesty and sit and rule on His throne..."
This Is also where the 30 pieces of silver element comes from.
On this topic see an old thread I did.
Temple Talk.
In short it seems at an early stage this tradition was altered. The statement was perceived as a Messianic claim, but as time went on it became necessary to adjust this element. Matt and Mark distance Jesus from the statement by saying it was a lie, but the Gospel John instead has him say it but turns it into a metaphor.
Sorry I have trouble with the quote function sometimes.
-
152
Do JWs believe Jesus is an angel?
by slimboyfat ini would suggest:.
the short answer is yes.. the longer answer is a qualified yes, with some caveats.
the short answer is yes because jehovah’s witnesses teach that jesus is michael the archangel, their leader, eldest and most powerful, and have taught this since the very beginning of the religion.
-
-
peacefulpete
aqwsed.....I'm sure you are sincere and the response you just posted was convincing to you.
The evangelists do not idealize Jesus: they describe how some people despise Christ because He is the carpenter's son (Mt. 13:54), etc.
However, if the evangelists were frauds, as Bauer (19th century) claimed, they would have certainly omitted these unfavorable details!Or more likely the writer used the term 'tekton' craftsman/builder due to the popularized interpretation of Zech 1. There would 4 craftsman who would serve as Messianic figures. The One called Messiah ben Joseph (son of Joseph) would be killed but another named Messiah ben David would succeed in conquering the enemies of Israel. It was brilliant use of OT source material for the Gospels to say Jesus as the son of Joseph was killed but as son of David, he would be a conqueror.
There is also the then common expectation that the Messiah would rebuild the Temple at play.
And of course, the standard trope of humble beginning (such as David, Moses etc.) and reversal of fate/expectations (peripeteia) is at play. Fleshing out the story using OT and related materials as well as literary standards.
-
33
Museum Pic
by peacefulpete ina lot of ink has been spilled on the topic of the cross.
the wt felt it had uncovered some deep conspiracy when they found a number of words were used to describe how jesus was understood to have been killed.
there was an extensive thread many years ago that in short strongly supports the conclusion that at least some nt writers envisioned a cross, while others had a tree in mind.
-
-
peacefulpete
btt
-
21
2nd Isaiah 49:6
by peacefulpete in6 and he said, it is too small a thing that thou shouldest be servant to me to raise up the sons of jacob, and to bring back the netzurei yisroel (preserved of israel,); i will also give thee for ohr goyim, that thou mayest be my yeshuah unto the ketzeh ha’aretz.. 2nd isaiah, actually an anonymous prophet at the time of cyrus, did his best to inspire and hearten his fellow countrymen.
many judahites had lost hope and even lost faith.
the explanations offered by previous prophets, namely that their own sins had resulted in their situation, were not adequate nor convincing.
-
-
peacefulpete
btt
-
43
Did Jesus Die On a Stake or a Cross?
by Sea Breeze indominic enyart exposes watchtower deception regarding their demonization of the cross.
information packed.
interesting take on paganism as well.
-
-
peacefulpete
btt
-
152
Do JWs believe Jesus is an angel?
by slimboyfat ini would suggest:.
the short answer is yes.. the longer answer is a qualified yes, with some caveats.
the short answer is yes because jehovah’s witnesses teach that jesus is michael the archangel, their leader, eldest and most powerful, and have taught this since the very beginning of the religion.
-
-
peacefulpete
The Gospels are not just creative adaptations to make Christianity more accessible; they are rooted in the eyewitness testimony of those who knew and followed Jesus. Early Christians did not believe in an abstract Christ who existed only in the spiritual realm—
That of course the often-repeated orthodoxy of believers. You are aware however that the Gospels themselves are anonymous works. The names in the identical superscriptions on each were chosen by someone in the mid/late 2nd century with the idea of masking the fact that the Synoptics especially are in fact revisions of the same document and create the myth that they were produced by eyewitness and associates. It seems somewhat ironic that 2 men who were said to be illiterate, (perhaps as a literary device explaining their having not written anything) were later assigned as authors of Gospels. Many other Gospels were similarly attributed to characters within the Gospel story or Pauline material. It is special pleading to insist these 4 are different. Was the Gospel of Thomas written by Thomas? The Gospel of Judas, the Gospel of Barnabus, Gospel of Peter, the Gospel of Nicodemus and many others?? If the motive for assigning these works to 'eyewitnesses' was to add persuasiveness, why not assume the same for the other 4.
You again returned to a statement that 'early' Christians believed in a Jesus as the Gospels describe. What you think of as "early" is in my mind already the 2nd or 3rd layer of the onion.
Ascn, of Isaiah again:
11. His eyes indeed were open, but his mouth was silent, and the mind in his body was taken up from him.
12. But his breath was (still) in him, for he was seeing a vision.
13. And the angel who was sent to show him (the vision) was not of this firmament, nor was he from the angels of glory of this world, but he came from the seventh heaven.
14. And the people who were standing by, apart from the circle of prophets, did [not] think that the holy Isaiah had been taken up.
15. And the vision which he saw was not from this world, but from the world which is hidden from the flesh.
It must be acknowledged that at least some 'early' Christians such as the author and readers of this work (and likely Paul as well) did not understand the passion drama as earthly.
-
152
Do JWs believe Jesus is an angel?
by slimboyfat ini would suggest:.
the short answer is yes.. the longer answer is a qualified yes, with some caveats.
the short answer is yes because jehovah’s witnesses teach that jesus is michael the archangel, their leader, eldest and most powerful, and have taught this since the very beginning of the religion.
-
-
peacefulpete
Comparing this development to how Hinduism may have turned metaphors into literal stories overlooks the unique emphasis that Christianity places on historical revelation. While there are metaphorical elements in Christian teaching, the core of the faith is grounded in historical claims about Jesus’ actions and identity.
This comment could be taken as a confirmation of my earlier statements. In the marketplace of ideas, the forms of Christianity that euhemerized the Christ as a guy walking around Palestine doing countless miracles before being killed by humans, had an advantage over the esoteric revelatory versions. In my mind it is easier to create a cult of a man than a cult based upon what might have sounded like a metaphysical abstraction. The addition of the Gospel narratives unquestionably saved Christianity from obscurity.