Taken in.
I thought it was absolutely read until I read the follow up posts.
That was incredibly good.
ScenicViewer
JoinedPosts by ScenicViewer
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49
Questions From Readers - October 20th, 2010
by sd-7 inwhy are jehovah's witnesses as a whole not permitted to read the elder's manual?.
on the first day of the unfermented cakes, well before his arrest and sacrificial death, jesus christ instructed his disciples on how to prepare for the passover.
when he did so, he did not provide advance, detailed instructions for all of his disciples; instead, he dispatched only two of them to find a suitable location, which he evidently had already planned with the householder.
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Scriptural rebuttal of the "two witness" rule relevant to JW child abuse policy - Timothy Kline article
by yadda yadda 2 informer jw timothy kline wrote an excellent article in 2002 that examines from a scriptural perspective the watchtower society's "two witnesses" requirement applicable to child abuse allegations (called "part 1" but there appears to be no further parts).
the article shows there are certainly alternative interpretations available to the watchtower society that would allow them to easily adjust this flawed aspect of their policy while still adhering to scriptural principles.
16 but if he does not listen, take along with you one or two more, in order that at the mouth of two or three witnesses every matter may be established.
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ScenicViewer
I just now saw this and haven't read the article yet, but...
I've always felt that Watchtower's insistence on using the 2-witness rule in child abuse cases was a complete misapplication of scripture, and that the real reason it is being used is to keep the problem of child molesting quiet in order to protect the Organization's public image. After all the judgemental finger-pointing that Watchtower has done to other religious groups it wouldn't do to let it be known JWs are no different.
I am going to savor this article!
Thanks for the post.
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Has a wrong disfellowshipping ever been reversed?
by lostnotfound inim not talking about simply being reinstated.
i remember hearing a story about a brother that was disfellowshipped because of the testimony of two false witnesses.
years passed before they admitted to lying about the brother and was reinstated.. what is policy in this sort of situation?
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ScenicViewer
itsybitsybrainbutbigenoughtosmellarat,
did your story happen in Arizona?
No, it was in central California. Do you know of a similar case in Az?
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Has a wrong disfellowshipping ever been reversed?
by lostnotfound inim not talking about simply being reinstated.
i remember hearing a story about a brother that was disfellowshipped because of the testimony of two false witnesses.
years passed before they admitted to lying about the brother and was reinstated.. what is policy in this sort of situation?
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ScenicViewer
I know of one DF'ing that was reversed in the 1970s.
An announcement was made that Brother _______ has been disfellowshipped. (that's the way it was said then)
The announcement was aparrently made too early, not allowing for his appeal, because 2 weeks later it was announced that "the DF'ing of Brother ______ has been rescinded."
I'm not sure what the details were, but I believe it had to do with financial dealings because he was an accountant, and a relative who worked with him in his business was also DF'd; the relative was somewhat of a scam artist, always had some kind of a get-rich-quick scheme going.
The relative's DF'ing stuck.
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Nancy Yuen China 1953- 23 years jail for refusing to stop door to door! Why did she do it?
by Witness 007 inthe new communist government were reasonable.
you can preach in your halls just not "door to door.
" missionary stanley jones and other non chinese stoped...but encouraged the chinese brothers to continue.
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ScenicViewer
Is it true that missionary Witnesses stopped going door to door, but encouraged Chinese Witnesses to keep doing it?
Why? The double standard of that is awful.
It also shows the lack of love that the Watchtower organization has for it's rank-and-file followers. It leaves the feeling that people are disposable to Watchtower as long as a good persecution story can be published, which can often be spun into a good sales pitch to make the Organization grow.
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I Keep Hearing About Conti's? What's the 411?
by slipnslidemaster inthere was a conti that was a do in my circuit a few years ago.
who are the conti's that everyone is talking about?
?.
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ScenicViewer
A few more reports that are still on the internet.
Examiner, http://www.examiner.com/article/jehovah-s-witnesses-ordered-to-pay-21-million-child-sex-abuse-case
Mercury News, http://www.mercurynews.com/breaking-news/ci_20867873/jehovahs-witnesses-must-pay-20-million-fremont-sex
U.S. News, http://www.usnews.com/news/us/articles/2012/06/16/calif-jury-awards-28m-in-jehovahs-sex-abuse-case
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What JW catch phrase DRIVES YOU NUTS!!!!
by megaflower in"we should be mindful".
grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr.
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ScenicViewer
"New Light."
It's the crutch that Witnesses use to explain away a long list of past lies.
There are some great responses here, expressions I haven't heard in years. When you see them all in one place it becomes strikingly clear that Witnesses are speaking the language of a cult.
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1975 AWAKE!!! Predictions
by iamwhoiam inover at the archives..enjoy!.
http://archive.org/details/1975predictionsinawakemagazinebyjehovahswitnesses.
*click on pdf at the left side of the page.
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ScenicViewer
Haelcer, I would like to have that download but I couldn't figure out how to get it without registering to something.
Any suggestions anybody?
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Can Publishers buy "Scratch Off" tickets?
by skeeter1 insee title?
someone i know has gloated that he bought $15 of scratch off tickets, and won $35.
i thought one could not gamble, and it would include scratch off tickets..
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ScenicViewer
The Elder’s Manual seems to say it two different ways.
I. Gambling is to be avoided in all it’s forms.
(Shepherd the Flock of God, p69 (the 2010 Elder’s Manual))
“Christians should avoid gambling in all it's various forms, including lotteries. If a person makes a practice of gambling and after repeated counsel unrepentantly pursues a course of greediness, judicial action would be appropriate."II. Petty gambling for entertainment is ok.
(Shepherd the Flock of God, p70 (the 2010 Elder’s Manual))“The elders do well not to involve themselves in what individuals do with regard to petty gambling solely for entertainment. They may need to give counsel if this becomes a cause of stumbling for others or affects the spirituality of the individual or the congregation.”
Once again the Organization seems to be saying it both ways.
It seems so unclear these days. I guess they can get you if they want you, but if they want to let you slide they have a basis for that too.
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Still Waiting For the Governing Body To Explain Their New Light
by Cameron_Don inregarding the governing bodys new light relative to matthew 24:45-47, anointedjw.org recently said the following:.
this new light certainly poses a problem for the governing body.
perhaps this is another reason why they have not yet published a sober and scriptural xplanation of this new light.
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ScenicViewer
Cameron_Don said,
It may well be that their “new light” may just create an even bigger mess when or if they ever do try to explain it.
I believe you are right. There are a few issues that need to be explained; not that they will ever attempt to answer the hard questions, they may just ignore them for years, but I'm wondering about these...
Why did it take so long?
If the GB is the Faithful Slave (when they are gathered to gether and in session), and the Slave was appointed in 1919, why are we just now being informed of this in 2012? Why didn't the previous groups of men that formed the GB have a clue about their identity?
It doesn't inspire confidence in these men that they didn't know who they were for over 90 years.
Circular reasoning
Where is the proof that the new understanding is true? There should be hard Scriptural evidence, but instead we have a Governing Body declaring that they themselves are the Slave. How do we know it's true? Because the GB says so! That is curcular reasoning in a very simple form.
Where is Jesus?
If I remember correctly the Slave is declared to be Faithful by Jesus when he returns. At least the old understanding fit this scenario (Slave is appointed in 1st Century, then declared faithful after Jesus' 1914 return), but with the 'new light' where did Jesus go after he made the initial appointment in 1919? What is he doing there? When will he be back? Are there Biblical answers to these questions?
Faithful Slave, or Evil Slave?
The Slave was either going to be Faithful or Evil, which would be determined by Jesus after his return. At this point we are told the Slave has been appointed (1919), but we can't know for sure if the Slave is Faithful or Evil because Jesus has not yet returned to make that judgment. At this time it is impossible for the GB to declare itself to be the 'Faithful' Slave. Even if the 'new light' is partially true, the Slave might be judged 'Evil' when Jesus returns from where ever he is.
It seems like this new information about the Slave was made up by a group of children playing King-of-the-Hill.
(AnnOMaly has a great idea, that they are testing the waters by watching the internet before they publish it to Witnesses. That's funny! They need 'apostates' to help them clarify this silly belief.)