Posts by TheStumbler

posted

69
Evidence Regarding the Evolution of Cetaceans - Whales etc
by cofty in
1. watchtower
2. beliefs
this excellent little video sumamrises some of the evidence for the evolutionary history of cetaceans.. if focuses on comparative anatomy, embryology, fossils and dna.. .... .

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TheStumbler

@runforver, when you put it like that it is so obvious. Wake up people!
39
The frustration of talking to a person with a closed mind
by TheStumbler in
1. watchtower
2. beliefs
okay, this is going to be a bit of a general rant.

i had a long conversation with a jw elder recently about shunning and evolution.

i became qunite frustrated with the conversation and admitted this at the time.
TheStumbler

I just scrolled up the page looking to see who this TS character was. Then the penny dropped. Haha.

I don't mind beliefs, I hold my own beliefs which I can't objectively prove. It's when people claim their own facts that frustrates me. I know I should let it go. I know it's my problem. Its been bothering me for days and. It's impacted my sleep.

I think it's his ignorance of evolution and insistence that it is base on faith and unwillingness to even look at the evidence. I take it as such an insult as someone who was raised a creationist but took the time to actually understand the science.
39
The frustration of talking to a person with a closed mind
by TheStumbler in
1. watchtower
2. beliefs
okay, this is going to be a bit of a general rant.

i had a long conversation with a jw elder recently about shunning and evolution.

i became qunite frustrated with the conversation and admitted this at the time.
TheStumbler

Could anyone explain the 'we don't try to convert people' thing? Is that a conmon JW claim?

I'm sure they spin it somehow but how do they not see that are being deceptive? When you were in, did you ever feel uncomfortable with the way you were asked to spin the 'truth'?
39
The frustration of talking to a person with a closed mind
by TheStumbler in
1. watchtower
2. beliefs
okay, this is going to be a bit of a general rant.

i had a long conversation with a jw elder recently about shunning and evolution.

i became qunite frustrated with the conversation and admitted this at the time.
TheStumbler

@ dismissive servant. He kept going on about science offering no hope. It's such a non argument. I asked him 'if a Doctor told you that you had cancer it wouldn't give any hope but would that make what he said any less true?'. He missed the point and started talking about the new system.
39
The frustration of talking to a person with a closed mind
by TheStumbler in
1. watchtower
2. beliefs
okay, this is going to be a bit of a general rant.

i had a long conversation with a jw elder recently about shunning and evolution.

i became qunite frustrated with the conversation and admitted this at the time.
TheStumbler

@zeb, I know you are right but that's exactoy what I find so hard to accept. I know I need to deal with it better.
39
The frustration of talking to a person with a closed mind
by TheStumbler in
1. watchtower
2. beliefs
okay, this is going to be a bit of a general rant.

i had a long conversation with a jw elder recently about shunning and evolution.

i became qunite frustrated with the conversation and admitted this at the time.
TheStumbler

That was a good rant. I wish I could be as articulate.

I did did try that approach. For example when he said that evolution was based on lies i asked for a specific example and he just said 'well, it must be'. He doesn't usually like to discuss details and instead jumps from one assertion to the next which I trouble to keep up with. for example, I started explaining ERVS and he ignores it and starts talking about how a tree needs a foundation or it will collapse. I explain how that abiogenesis is seperate from evolution and he starts talking about how theories are unproven. Around it goes in circles.

I asked him to explain what he thought a theory was, he just ignored the question. I pointed out how Einstein's theories have been confirmed as true and are used to calculate the positions of sattelites in GPS. Not even 5 minutes later he starts talking about how evolution is still a theory. It's infuriating.

You can't have a conversation with someone about tgis stuff if they basically ignore evidence and reason.
39
The frustration of talking to a person with a closed mind
by TheStumbler in
1. watchtower
2. beliefs
okay, this is going to be a bit of a general rant.

i had a long conversation with a jw elder recently about shunning and evolution.

i became qunite frustrated with the conversation and admitted this at the time.
TheStumbler
39
The frustration of talking to a person with a closed mind
by TheStumbler in
1. watchtower
2. beliefs
okay, this is going to be a bit of a general rant.

i had a long conversation with a jw elder recently about shunning and evolution.

i became qunite frustrated with the conversation and admitted this at the time.
TheStumbler

One interesting thing, the elder told me that every person they have disfellowshipped has fallen into druga, depression or some other trouble and most of them have returned and thanked him for disfellowshiping them. This is possible but I think unlikely. I think he's lying to himself about it.

He became very defensive about the shunning issue. Told me I didn't know anything about it - although didn't say anything I specifically said was wrong. I think he might be dealing with his own doubts about it.
39
The frustration of talking to a person with a closed mind
by TheStumbler in
1. watchtower
2. beliefs
okay, this is going to be a bit of a general rant.

i had a long conversation with a jw elder recently about shunning and evolution.

i became qunite frustrated with the conversation and admitted this at the time.
TheStumbler

@jnat, yeah they play with words for sure. they commonly claim the don't try to convery people. i know they rationalise it but how do they not realise that is being weasely to the point if dishonesty.

one JW recently admitted to me that they shun people who leave on conscience grounds (he tried comparing them to paedophiles - you wouldn't associate with then would you?). I though about asking him to explain the JW.org FAQ where it denies that they shun former members.
39
The frustration of talking to a person with a closed mind
by TheStumbler in
1. watchtower
2. beliefs
okay, this is going to be a bit of a general rant.

i had a long conversation with a jw elder recently about shunning and evolution.

i became qunite frustrated with the conversation and admitted this at the time.
TheStumbler

I have tried that approach and he ignores my questions or answers a different question. I am very aware that when I talk about evolution he switches off and doesn't really engage what I say. He'a already decided in his mind it is untrue so any contrary evidence is autonatically dismissed as lies. He has more as admitted this.